To: opendos AT delorie DOT com Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2000 18:28:48 -0800 Subject: Re: Using Loader with DRDOS and WIN95 Message-ID: <20000123.182930.-4055313.1.domanspc@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-5,7-25,27-29,31,33,35-36,38,40,42,44,46,48-52,54-56,58,60,62,64,66,68,70,72,74,76,78,80-81,83,85,87,89,91,93,95,97,99,101-103,105-107,109-126,128-130,132,134-140,142,144,146-148,150-151,153-156,158,160,162-167 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: robert w moss Reply-To: opendos AT delorie DOT com What we are dealing with here is the compatibility of DRDOS with a WIN95 operating system on the same computer. How compatible is DRDOS with 32bit API and does it work in a Long Filename environment. Most likely that is one of the causes for not being able to set up LOADER. The last I heard (and my experience with MS/PC/and especially DRDOS) DOS will not even see WIN95 on the computer and will cause serious problems, the least of which is to lock-up the computer...see my comments below.. *Any of the old DRDOS/Caldera guys feel free to clarify?* ----------------------------------------------------------------- Bob 'DOMAN' Moss *"Remember, if you don't have chocolate* * you don't have food"!!!!.............* ======================================== On Sat, 22 Jan 2000 00:48:11 -0500 Bruce Morgen writes: > > > On Fri, 21 Jan 2000 16:38:23 -0800 robert w moss > writes: > > [snip] > > > ie; WIN95 wants all its applications on drive C. > > This doesn't reflect my experience at all -- my son's PC boots Win95's DOS 7 from > drive C: Sorry to say that there are only two 'MSDOS' files on a WIN95 computer. They are msdos.sys and io.sys and they are used to boot the computer and pass over the control of the computer to the WIN32 Application Programming Interface (API). This MSDOS 7 is a DOS Emulator sysytem built up of 32bit API versions of the old DOS files. These files can be found in \Windows\Command and are not DOS. You can download the old DOS files from the MS download site but they don't work well in a DOS window because they are not written to comply with 32bit API. Thats why DRDOS has problems, and will continue to do so, until it is written to be compatible with the 32bit API's and FAT32 and has long file name recognition in Command.Com the way 4DOS does. They have a version made for WIN95 but I have not tried it yet.. (a BIOS limitation that has nothing to do with the OS) and has the entire > WINDOWS directory tree happily ensconced on drive E:. I have only seen that on some HP or Compaq systems where they run a propritary version of a pc-compatible. I tried it with mine and Had all sorts of trouble. MS designed the FAT32 so that one large hard disk could store everything without loosing large amounts of hard disk space like we do with DOS and WIN31/311 systems and large drive/large partitions. On a FAT32 system clusters are only 8k up to 8GB versus 64k on a 2048-4096MB FAT16 system, and most of the post 1995 BIOS let you use up to 5GB hard drives and all the extraspace is available for use with the large files used in windows environment . Now, almost all the Windows applications are setup to go on drive c: , although they do let you choose expert install and put the program anywhere you choose and even use a different folder name (this can really confuse the issue, especially if you take your computer to a shop to be worked on). All of the stuff I put in drive D:/E:/F: caused problems. I installed Corel Perfect office, MS Office, MS Works, Serif PagePlus, Print Master Gold, Norton Utilities, among others, just so I could install AOL, Nescape, and IE5 on C:. I had to have 500MG free just to install IE5. After I got all this stuff on the computer I started having problems with files trying to load off C: when I had put them on D:/E: and scandisk started finding large blocks of files lost in limbo land, so I had to uninstall everything and start over. Half of the stuff would not un-install properly and I had to hand massage the registry. I have just finished spending two weeks getting enough of the garbage out of the Registry so I can begin re-installing everthing without getting calls for the loading of files that are not on the computer anymore, or not on drive c: because I put the programs on another drive. At least I have Partition Magic to change the size of my drives so I can have one large C: drive. >The location of the various crucial Win95 directory hierarchies is contained >in the hidden Msdos.sys text file. Heres a copy of the hidden msdos.sys text file as I extracted it from my WIN95 root Directory: ;FORMAT [Paths] WinDir=C:\WINDOWS WinBootDir=C:\WINDOWS HostWinBootDrv=C [Options] BootMulti=1 BootGUI=1 Network=0 ; ;The following lines are required for compatibility with other programs. ;Do not remove them (MSDOS.SYS needs to be >1024 bytes). ;xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxa all I see here is the same thing they had in Win31/311. The computer is directed to the Windows directory and told to boot in multiuser and GUI mode. >in the root directory of drive C:, and they can be on any logical drive > accessible to DOS 7, that is, any logical drive that doesn't require the GUI's > driver code for access. > > > [snip] > > WIN98 is completely DOS free and BILL GATES brags about that all the time. DOS programs must be handled very carefully to run on these systems as the DOS programmers normally setup the programs to take over the entire computer and when they do they over-write windows code and crash the system. WIN95/98 attempts to load DOS programs in a virtual computer mode where they are not aware of windows and operate in their own space, but that frequently not enough and most WIN95/98 users do not attempt to use DOS (dinosaur) stuff because they are tired of rebuilding the computer and also there are lots of wimpy windows applications/games which use the installed windows librarys to run without crashing. Maybe you can see I don't really like Windoze. But I have to use it at work and all my children and grandchildren need it for school work, so I have it. Glad to hear that you have never had a problem with your son's computer. May your good luck follow you into the future! > ________________________________________________________________ > YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE > Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE > software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.