X-Authentication-Warning: delorie.com: mail set sender to geda-user-bounces using -f X-Recipient: geda-user AT delorie DOT com Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2018 04:33:02 +0200 (CEST) X-X-Sender: igor2 AT igor2priv To: "Marvin Dickens (mpdickens AT gmail DOT com) [via geda-user AT delorie DOT com]" X-Debug: to=geda-user AT delorie DOT com from="gedau AT igor2 DOT repo DOT hu" From: gedau AT igor2 DOT repo DOT hu Subject: Re: [geda-user] shorted pads and the netlist in PCB In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: <04df2ed2-45a1-dff5-6f6c-d9b9d5fcca0f AT neurotica DOT com> User-Agent: Alpine 2.00 (DEB 1167 2008-08-23) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: MULTIPART/MIXED; BOUNDARY="0-157042733-1531276382=:8169" Reply-To: geda-user AT delorie DOT com Errors-To: nobody AT delorie DOT com X-Mailing-List: geda-user AT delorie DOT com X-Unsubscribes-To: listserv AT delorie DOT com Precedence: bulk This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text, while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools. --0-157042733-1531276382=:8169 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE On Tue, 10 Jul 2018, Marvin Dickens (mpdickens AT gmail DOT com) [via geda-user AT de= lorie.com] wrote: >Well, I am not a unicorn... > >This bug has been around for over a *decade* and has been one of the deal >breakers for us. >A solid net list is required when bringing up non-trivial boards for the >first time and later during DUT >after engineering changes / repair.=C2=A0 Well, maybe time to switch to pcb-rnd then. We fixed most of these decade= =20 old design errors, bugs, misfeatures already. Not by kludging some quick=20 hack on top of the existing bag-of-special-cases, but by switching to a=20 more orthogonal data model that avoids special casing. Note: pcb-rnd is compatible. It can read and write the file format of=20 geda/PCB (just as it can read kicad, eagle, protel, etc. See:=20 http://repo.hu/projects/pcb-rnd/user/09_appendix/bridges.svg ) About your specific case: In pcb-rnd, for a year already, you can have copper in footprints that are= =20 not "pins" or "pads", thus are invisible to netlist. Still you can make=20 them look exactly like pins or pads (remove solder mask above them or add= =20 paste, add thermal, etc). More technically speaking, the features you may be interested in: - We don't have the old pcb element limitations, such as only pins/pads=20 can create copper or mask or paste objects in elements; you can have any=20 object in a footprint, on any layer. - the mask and paste layers are not special hacks anymore that can be accessed through smd pads and pins and vias only; they are explicit layers, exactly like any copper layer, and you can draw on them. (This is= =20 like that for about 1.5 years already.) - We have a "new" (~8 months old) pin/pad/via replacement, padstack; we=20 have fully decoupled the "part of the netlist" thing from the geometry, so= =20 you can basically go there to any padstack and just remove the terminal id= =20 ("pin number") and while there is zero change in the geometry, it=20 immediately becomes invisible to the netlist. (In return you don't have to= =20 use the padstack object to make a netlisted thing; just assign a temrinal= =20 ID to any copper object and boom, it's a pad) - Bonus: a padstack can have any shape and you can have thermals on it.=20 Yes, this does mean proper, on-click thermal on SMD pads. See:=20 http://repo.hu/cgi-bin/pool.cgi?cmd=3Dshow&node=3Dthermals - Bonus 2: we have some extra minor features related to these things, for= =20 years already: the "nonetlist" flag that cna make an entire footprint=20 invisible to the netlist (so you can place your mounting holes or test=20 pads or 0 ohm SMD jumpers without having to add them to the schematics);=20 the "intconn" for terminals, so you can tell pcb-rnd that your=20 footprint's pin/pad 2 and 15 are galvanically connected internally in the= =20 package. - Bonus 3: padstacks can have any shape, not just round or square or=20 octagon. This includes oblong/oval shape or arbitrary polygon shape. You=20 can have different shape/size on internal copper layers or top or bottom=20 copper layer or basically on any layer as there's no more magic=20 (automatically generated side effect shapes, like mask and paste was in=20 PCB) Regards, Igor2 --0-157042733-1531276382=:8169--