X-Authentication-Warning: delorie.com: mail set sender to geda-user-bounces using -f X-Recipient: geda-user AT delorie DOT com X-Original-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=JLPMkJhMpTj0NGsA81/jGUQuml/tenSGjWGLMNMI8JU=; b=0ZGV6QQJ3ROm4FOcdGDSJKAz4xxMKgeEzDl26YArPl8Za4AXuzv+JfhvkcYT7dkDfB nTF/OLlOTGBKX2n+EDXXGSnB9K0bvqR96DYIMbcXPWPUHAA5U4PcVepZO1xthzFrj4ow vEIpL/JZ27kGsjr/JgXabajpDH0mpcRKxWL2lDr4hYqH2Hn+HgF/vGeEaAZmljEwxlNg 12drbVVwvx0wsOifO/R3P6hgkRftPhhqDNZxCboJswhvj3/W+/oPiGLxztTZYM03tPMx P1ELGLf2IfOU6sqSoAkx+rQ2ervQvIe4/Eu+or+B2NFAUlIFWJYBVTW8curItWMpNgIP +O3g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=JLPMkJhMpTj0NGsA81/jGUQuml/tenSGjWGLMNMI8JU=; b=Yd+yxygGb74mkkJnEHx63WxIYGo1gTxFKtAsI1cBTDIiljd3kaxBmRYaLnoH8v3quI j35QntGetB6XiULjMvGFP8gCfiiMH2EyjllsuAJqJ21GDF9u/DaOnAQzWvhKYL7+8N23 kxHr0q9pS+4KkRL9K13i46iv8SlOTo/6wBu/08KuELGz3ClA0J+TyGKu3mWg7GgwTVg5 7xCAmUhCQ7NhDmZL9aqsv+1AVwqg25oiyyK+V0aZxuaWCb1014PcrL3D0qgei+50N/ZY o0HW+5FZr80FMYZveE7d7OyzWFPYuTlJupR5NYcgEY+9lfcc0SCNuoygReGU2hRNHvsb +O/Q== X-Gm-Message-State: AG10YOQD+PFMAnWp0K6DGwfCtXPCKqrEnoHFgU0Re2PREwlZJqVt1EVJ1jLLokweymqS4oFosdoBI7Jjk2DQfA== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.202.88.65 with SMTP id m62mr3914524oib.36.1454016289783; Thu, 28 Jan 2016 13:24:49 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: <201601261804 DOT u0QI4KEQ009550 AT envy DOT delorie DOT com> <20160126233332 DOT dec2f06f5c74354a3841989c AT gmail DOT com> <20160127091746 DOT 1c7a976c2752f913921688ac AT gmail DOT com> <20160127141334 DOT c738feb9dbeb54a7dec3dff8 AT gmail DOT com> <56A8F74B DOT 8080304 AT ecosensory DOT com> <56A961BC DOT 3040405 AT ecosensory DOT com> <56A9E416 DOT 8080500 AT ecosensory DOT com> Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2016 22:24:49 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [geda-user] The nature of gEDA layers From: "Nicklas Karlsson (nicklas DOT karlsson17 AT gmail DOT com) [via geda-user AT delorie DOT com]" To: geda-user AT delorie DOT com Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a113d2c0273446c052a6b8c3d Reply-To: geda-user AT delorie DOT com Errors-To: nobody AT delorie DOT com X-Mailing-List: geda-user AT delorie DOT com X-Unsubscribes-To: listserv AT delorie DOT com Precedence: bulk --001a113d2c0273446c052a6b8c3d Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable To use via/pin/pad from a predefined library and be able to update them would be very nice then a small adjustment is needed. Sometimes a pad need to have a little bit unusual shape and in such cases it is very useful with possibility to add the necessary shape on the needed layer. For example a power pad or antenna. I am looking at clearance and maybe it is possible with a small step in this direction at the same time. Nicklas Karlsson 2016-01-28 21:46 GMT+01:00 Britton Kerin (britton DOT kerin AT gmail DOT com) [via geda-user AT delorie DOT com] : > On Thu, Jan 28, 2016 at 11:08 AM, Stephan B=C3=B6ttcher w= rote: > > "Britton Kerin (britton DOT kerin AT gmail DOT com) [via geda-user AT delorie DOT com]" > > writes: > > > >> It's highly unlikely it'll be easier for just BBVias. I believe > >> there's already an experimental branch that implements them. Igor is > >> likely to decide to implement them again while we all talk about it. > >> For containers to pay off several other applications for them would > >> need to exist and be important enough to get implemented. What are > >> they? > > > > My use cases for a mor egeneralized data model: > > > > - pad stacks, with differnet pad sizes on middle layers > > Everyone seems to want these, to be honest I don't understand what > pads on middle layers are for. Not mounting components for sure. If > it's just a node what's wrong with a trace or poly? > > > - hierarchical layout > > It can be done now... > > > - rigid-flex baords with more than two outer layers > > I've never done these. I guess the flexing connector layer is on top, > but only where it exists so you can still have components on the layer > below? > There's still only one top layer at any given point? > > > To avoid more spagetti special casing in the future for all kinds of > > use cases. > > I've just been through a lot of DRC and while it's true that e.g. > geometrical tests could be concentrated in Union types or something, > they're still gonna have to go somewhere and it wasn't that bad to > find them as they are. Adding abstractions that aren't universally > utilized doesn't necessarily make a code any more comprehensible, > because sometimes-utilized abstractions are arguably more confusing > than none at all. To justify things like containers on > code-cleanliness grounds a big refactor effort is implied. > > Britton > > --001a113d2c0273446c052a6b8c3d Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
To use via/pin/pad from a predefined library and be a= ble to update them would be very nice then a small adjustment is needed.

Sometimes a pad need to have a little bit unusual sh= ape and in such cases it is very useful with possibility to add the necessa= ry shape on the needed layer. For example a power pad or antenna.
=

I am looking at clearance and maybe it is possible with= a small step in this direction at the same time.

= Nicklas Karlsson


<= div class=3D"gmail_quote">2016-01-28 21:46 GMT+01:00 Britton Kerin (britton DOT kerin AT gmail DOT com) [via geda-user AT delorie DOT com] <geda-u= ser AT delorie DOT com>:
On Thu, Jan 28, 2016 at 11:08 AM, Stephan B=C3=B6ttcher <geda AT psjt DOT org> wrote:
> "Britton Kerin (britto= n DOT kerin AT gmail DOT com) [via geda-u= ser AT delorie DOT com]"
> <geda-user AT delorie DOT com= > writes:
>
>> It's highly unlikely it'll be easier for just BBVias.=C2= =A0 I believe
>> there's already an experimental branch that implements them.= =C2=A0 Igor is
>> likely to decide to implement them again while we all talk about i= t.
>> For containers to pay off several other applications for them woul= d
>> need to exist and be important enough to get implemented.=C2=A0 Wh= at are
>> they?
>
> My use cases for a mor egeneralized data model:
>
>=C2=A0 - pad stacks, with differnet pad sizes on middle layers

Everyone seems to want these, to be honest I don't understand wh= at
pads on middle layers are for.=C2=A0 Not mounting components for sure.=C2= =A0 If
it's just a node what's wrong with a trace or poly?

>=C2=A0 - hierarchical layout

It can be done now...

>=C2=A0 - rigid-flex baords with more than two outer layers

I've never done these.=C2=A0 I guess the flexing connector layer= is on top,
but only where it exists so you can still have components on the layer
below?
There's still only one top layer at any given point?

> To avoid more spagetti special casing in the future for all kinds of > use cases.

I've just been through a lot of DRC and while it's true that= e.g.
geometrical tests could be concentrated in Union types or something,
they're still gonna have to go somewhere and it wasn't that bad to<= br> find them as they are.=C2=A0 Adding abstractions that aren't universall= y
utilized doesn't necessarily make a code any more comprehensible,
because sometimes-utilized abstractions are arguably more confusing
than none at all.=C2=A0 To justify things like containers on
code-cleanliness grounds a big refactor effort is implied.

Britton


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