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Date: Thu, 9 Jul 2015 03:46:10 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: developer excitement? was Re: [geda-user] gEDA/gschem still alive? From: "Evan Foss (evanfoss AT gmail DOT com) [via geda-user AT delorie DOT com]" To: geda-user AT delorie DOT com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Reply-To: geda-user AT delorie DOT com Errors-To: nobody AT delorie DOT com X-Mailing-List: geda-user AT delorie DOT com X-Unsubscribes-To: listserv AT delorie DOT com Precedence: bulk Erich I think you meant to post that to the other thread. On Thu, Jul 9, 2015 at 3:16 AM, Erich Heinzle (a1039181 AT gmail DOT com) [via geda-user AT delorie DOT com] wrote: > The reason I have been using Java for a few recent utilities is that it is > what is being taught in my comp sci subjects, and practical tasks help me to > familiarise myself with the language. > If we remain vaguely compatible with what the majority of comp sci and > engineering students are currently playing with, which, judging by a recent > stroll through the engineering/computer science portion of the campus > bookstore, would certainly include java, some c or c++, and python, common > sense would suggest that potential contributers are more likely to get > involved. > One big plus is we can quickly compile gEDA on a 1.6GHz netbook with 1 or > 2GB of RAM. The Kicad crowd are struggling to build without tens of gigs of > RAM and beastly CPUs at present. > > On Thu, Jul 9, 2015 at 11:21 AM, Evan Foss (evanfoss AT gmail DOT com) [via > geda-user AT delorie DOT com] wrote: >> >> John, I understand. I was soliciting idle talk hoping to find >> something actionable in it. Like market research only less gross and >> MBAish... >> >> >> On Thu, Jul 9, 2015 at 12:09 AM, Stefan Salewski >> wrote: >> > On Wed, 2015-07-08 at 22:02 +0000, Evan Foss (evanfoss AT gmail DOT com) [via >> > geda-user AT delorie DOT com] wrote: >> >> A few people have said that projects slow when developers loose >> >> interest. While everyone is here (admittadly sucked in by the gravity >> >> of the other thread) it is worth asking what would excite developer >> >> interest? >> > >> > Sorry to be so negative... >> > >> > But my feeling is, that chances for FOSS development in EDA area is >> > generally very bad today. Generally activity in Free Open Source seems >> > to shrink since a few years -- there may be many reasons for that. For >> > EDA area, interest of people in free open source software seems to be >> > especially low. >> >> No offence but this is not a new insight. It is after all why I asked >> the question. >> >> > Here in Germany we have a large microcontroller and >> > electronics forum -- very few people use KiCad, no one does contribute >> > actively. For most people cheap is good enough, which is eagle or >> > LT_Spice or the new web based tools, for example from Digikey. For the >> > gEDA area -- I have learned in the last years that people really hate >> > GTK. They hate the non native look for Mac and Windows, and they hate >> > GTK coding in plain C. Most people even ignore that there are GTK >> > bindings for many other languages available. When you do a google search >> > "GTK vs Qt" 95% will vote for Qt. No one starts new projects in GTK >> > today, some people may still work on Inkscape. >> >> I really like GTK. No offense to QT but my machine is gentoo with Mate >> as the desktop. I liked the feel and efficiency of GTK2 but I wanted >> GTK3 compatibility. >> >> > But Qt's popularity seems >> > to be shrinking now although, which indeed was my expectation for some >> > years already: Qt is a very big blob, closely coupled to C++, which is >> > not so popular although in these days any more. And Qt's strength was >> > the strong support by large companies in the past, which is gone now. >> >> That is why QT is antethetical to the Unix mentality of small atomic >> things the user combines into a flow. QT is more inline with what the >> kicad people are doing than geda. IMHO >> >> > With GTK, C, scheme there is really no hope for gEDA becoming popular >> > again. Qt seems to help not much, Qucs is Qt for example, but it is very >> > quiet. Exciting projects: Anthony's toporouter was considered exciting >> > by some people, but he retired, no one continued the work. The C code >> > was a nightmare indeed, I have understood nothing. Mr Wirts router was >> > called exciting, Java code was available for a period, someone wrote >> > that the code looked not bad. >> >> I have been on this list since it was on the older domain in 2004. I >> remember all of this. >> >> > Is there continuation? The push&shove CERN >> > router? Was called exciting. Is there continuation? Or Gnucap? Coded in >> > C++, I think no one except the original author ever worked on it. But >> > wait, there was a GSOC I think. No result? >> >> Yea remember all that too. (avoiding the topic of PCB because of my >> opinions starting other now tired debates) >> >> GSOC has faded into a shallow husk of it's former self. It now mostly >> exists to continue development of open source projects google finds >> valuable in the long term. At least as I see it. They dropped a number >> of former favourites last year and this one. >> >> > But generally, EDA development is not that hard today. With a fine >> > language, a fine GUI and good libraries a good EDA tool set can be >> > developed in only a few thousend hours I guess. GUI may be the main >> > problem, GTK is only accepted for Linux/Unix today. Native Mac or >> > Windows GUI maybe instead? Or Android, HTML5? >> >> I could debate that but it would just lead back into the other threads >> endless debate over the perfect language which will no doubt end it us >> all having to use PL/I, Ada or LISP for everything. >> >> -- >> Home >> http://evanfoss.googlepages.com/ >> Work >> http://forge.abcd.harvard.edu/gf/project/epl_engineering/wiki/ > > -- Home http://evanfoss.googlepages.com/ Work http://forge.abcd.harvard.edu/gf/project/epl_engineering/wiki/