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Message-ID: <508D302D.1030105@jump-ing.de>
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2012 14:16:29 +0100
From: Markus Hitter <mah AT jump-ing DOT de>
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To: geda-user AT delorie DOT com
Subject: Re: [geda-user] The state of gEDA/gaf (Was gEDA/PCBs diversity, Was:
 Pin hole size)
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Reply-To: geda-user AT delorie DOT com

Am 28.10.2012 09:13, schrieb Bert Timmerman:

> it's all about momentum and how the
> software is perceived at first glance ... "you never get a second chance
> for a first impression".

Bert,

first of all, be assured I find your plans excellent.

As we see in other posts, some gEDA users can't imagine how their 
Makefile workflow won't even be touched by alignments on the GUI level 
and outcry essentially on _any_ change to the toolkit. The reason of 
this (pardon) shortsightedness is beyond me, after all they could easily 
just stop updating their toolset.

> 0.
> Get the GUIs consistent with each other.

Excellent!

> 1.
> Pull in xgsch2pcb as a first point of entry, squash any bugs left and
> implement outstanding feature request.
> First step into integration, still keeping a use case for every single
> tool ;-)

Not so sure on this one. There is schematics import in pcb already, 
which does very similar things.

Is there an advantage of xgsch2pcb over pcb's schematics import? Does 
schematics import get into the way of using gsch2pcb manually somehow?

> 2.
> Now we are building an "integrated tool", maybe add something like
> "xgsch2gnucap" in to xgsch2pcb.

Excellent, too.

> 3.
> Integrate gattrib into gschem.
> IMO there is no use case for a stand alone usage.

Yupp. To be honest, I don't use gattrib. Mostly, because for a long time 
I didn't even know it exists.

> 5.
> Get 3D modeling "implemented" in pcb

I take you don't want to put a full fledged 3D modeler into pcb, but 
help making 3D models in dedicated applications easier.

> 7.
> Add a Breadboard GUI/tool for it is a possible next step in workflow
> after simulation (Gnucap) is done, and more often than not, done before
> layout time.
> Here we have a gap in our workflow which is not supported by gEDA (yet).

Yes. For my part I'll also continue on the G-code exporter. 3D printers 
become more and more popular, so milling or extruding (conductive 
paste!) prototype PCBs might be a commodity in a few years.

> 8.
> Please do fix the gem called toporouter !!!

How similar is this one to using pcb's menu -> connects -> optimize 
routed tracks -> global puller after doing traditional autorouting?

I mean, many bits are already there, they apparently just need some 
alignment and interconnection. For example I just tried to autoroute a 
track (menu -> connects -> auto-route selected rats) on an existing 
layout and it totally ignored the current route style and also put the 
track on a layer other than the selected layer without need. Not exactly 
what a newbie would expect and on the first spot I can't see how this is 
helpful for the professional, either.

> 9.
> In the mean time grab as many "drive-by" contributors of patches/diffs
> as you can get a hold on, lure them into making another contribution.
> Everything is allowed, just think up something.

Well said. Grabbing code helps avoiding duplicate work and having this 
in the central repo helps integrating this in a way it doesn't get into 
the way of others.


Markus

-- 
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Dipl. Ing. (FH) Markus Hitter
http://www.jump-ing.de/