X-Authentication-Warning: delorie.com: mail set sender to geda-help-bounces using -f X-Recipient: geda-help AT delorie DOT com X-Original-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=8JmLb1FfIWn/TkQuV36YeJuwdvLmSQlC+rZf6T4075k=; b=Snm6/UvHyc0k2wtgArbQaCBUkgQJPEpAzxrBdPM53QC4S7Qug9mw7IZ7ba24QyRTuk jh6qMbJIxkL2F30uTWXmkIOj7LRVLUg8IT8lhtC9hpJr0ByoCQGGmHF2EVZcKRlRE2d6 VDQ+gTgVJLB/ysa1F1o7F6mSQ+T2j/v1Q+oEirk6XtuPl7ybpXZSqXV5J5rc0+0XSa52 /TNci6D9fnaOZOemA1KZkIZsGnkcTjnWoKaNVgutq2xx8u0flKWYJqFRneOVWqE5QwZq MPMy/GlIfF3dx4it/Jm+sTdGgyH1pXbtj/R6I9c1sjGlLWXdOs6jK83aMA62e8loGLdz RHug== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=8JmLb1FfIWn/TkQuV36YeJuwdvLmSQlC+rZf6T4075k=; b=tjcZks5jty44QW5Q85SgaTi9r3wEmYOj3Xmbm8XEMsxUtCM2d1YumdpfsQhd73tsnJ vhvaHOihOr9ZVIxzk5XSsKM3/IbvTnC8YxVp3pSteKJpFzNHlHpiolF4FUAWz34zg5af xJ3EjjfXaJc/M1OYMZPWjnZxSLsSRdvtUZHMxH3fvtbNvsY+OErGaGt5Ca2QJflCtkNx qtKCGhj6kEcx34edUTivu0rMtzRasGr3tepk9Sn8gluO5yb4h+6d93lXJQ9t+L4uSJWQ XOzgTU9JBlc+2zdtV08e4YA6wxJPzKJD3KbdO6t93qn0H9ep6Pto1B0O92f+TXcqxFQv WNsQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532oSIn8vKzn7DY1kDkVq02Tke0ZpHSPCHRk/Vc1sNhG863tDMwK YxIVc1R6/cqHfGzRNbK7jfXqddlWHVq+kM2ClPZrpeia X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyNCqsDb/WTTA6CJLBZn/sSdP8UowB4I9OI5n6cUBo8DxrftjRRiCx/ee4tdbouM5VjFixgAGgs+1WAYytpmko= X-Received: by 2002:aa7:d40f:: with SMTP id z15mr1565982edq.247.1599115544630; Wed, 02 Sep 2020 23:45:44 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200829221451 DOT GA2565 AT newvzh DOT lokolhoz> <664de6c2-ad96-8298-1b64-ad550acfca64 AT k4gvo DOT com> <20200901193434 DOT GB19839 AT newvzh DOT lokolhoz> <20200902141116 DOT GA2911 AT newvzh DOT lokolhoz> <20200902165424 DOT GB2911 AT newvzh DOT lokolhoz> <333FD0E9-238C-445F-AEE4-850B0EA19A88 AT ece DOT orst DOT edu> <2A687A4D-3219-431E-8866-2D11C2418C81 AT noqsi DOT com> In-Reply-To: From: "Erich Heinzle (a1039181 AT gmail DOT com) [via geda-help AT delorie DOT com]" Date: Thu, 3 Sep 2020 16:15:31 +0930 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [geda-help] Linux - PCB Meander Antenna To: "Vladimir Zhbanov (vzhbanov AT gmail DOT com) [via geda-help AT delorie DOT com]" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000fe1a5605ae631972" Reply-To: geda-help AT delorie DOT com --000000000000fe1a5605ae631972 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable There are two other things to know for these sorts of applications 1) inkscape2pcb now exports (v0.92 inkscape) simple polygons to pcb-rnd footprints, as well as paths, allowing application note designs like this to be converted fairly easily from source documents to copper polygons. Footprints can then be scaled in x, y or both directions in pcb-rnd too. https://github.com/erichVK5/inkscape2pcb 2) pstoedit can do similar exports of postscript features to pcb layouts, and the next release should include code for a plugin that exports polygons to pcb-rnd footprints. http://www.calvina.de/pstoedit/pstoedit.htm The look and feel is much the same for pcb-rnd vs PCB, but keyboard shortcuts have had to evolve to keep up with the features. Regards, Erich On Thu, 3 Sep 2020 15:16 Roger Traylor (traylor AT engr DOT orst DOT edu) [via geda-help AT delorie DOT com], wrote: > Erich, > > Thanks for the info. I figured pcb-rnd could probably handle this > situation. > > Right now however, I need to get a job done. I=E2=80=99d like to try pcb= -rnd as > I've > followed the development for a while but it feels like the =E2=80=9Ctrain= has left > the > station=E2=80=9D as far as I=E2=80=99m concerned. It looks daunting to ge= t started with > and I > see no on-ramp for beginners. Maybe for the next project. > > Thanks again, > Roger > > On Sep 2, 2020, at 4:37 PM, Erich Heinzle (a1039181 AT gmail DOT com) [via > geda-help AT delorie DOT com] wrote: > > pcb-rnd allows polygons within footprint elements, as well as lines and > arcs, which, in combination with terminals, can produce the sorts of > structures you are playing with more easily. > > Importantly, there is also an "intnoconn" attribute that can be used on > copper features within the footprint > > http://repo.hu/cgi-bin/pool.cgi?cmd=3Dshow&node=3Dintnoconn > > That can be used, for example within a pcb spiral inductor, so that the > copper does not look like a short across the terminals. > > With the gEDA PCB footprint data model, you will have to paint the > features with pads, will end up with a short with DRC, and will have a > limited ability to manipulate the solder mask over the features, if neede= d. > > > Regards, > > Erich > > On Thu, 3 Sep 2020 08:43 Roger Traylor (traylor AT engr DOT orst DOT edu) [via > geda-help AT delorie DOT com], wrote: > >> Gang, >> A quick question for PCB gurus: >> >> I have a =E2=80=9Cfolded F=E2=80=9D antenna for 2.4Ghz. It has one open= end, one input >> for the signal >> and one matching stub that is to be connected to ground. >> >> I drew this in PCB as a series of =E2=80=9Cpads=E2=80=9D. I attempted to= make one pad =E2=80=9C1=E2=80=9D >> the input, >> and pad =E2=80=9C2=E2=80=9D as ground. gschem did not complain about th= e symbol, but PCB >> complains >> about not being able to find pad "2" (the ground pin). >> >> Could this be because PCB sees all the pads overlapping as one pad? If >> so, how can >> I overcome this problem? >> >> Thanks, >> Roger Traylor >> >> Footprint file is below: >> >> Element[0x00000000 "" "" "" 0 0 0 0 0 100 0x00000000] >> #Flipped Meander antenna for CC2500 >> #R. Traylor 7.27.2020 >> #50 ohm feed point is at end of segment 10 >> #requires via to ground plane at bottom of segment 11 >> #silk at bottom marks the edge of the ground plane >> #see TI/Chipcon Application Note AN043 >> #This is the flipped version of the original meander antenna >> # >> ( >> # X1 Y1 X2 Y2 thick clear mask name >> numb flag >> # right side from origin >> Pad[ 0 0 8661 0 1969 0 10000 "1" >> "1" 0x00000100] #segment 0 >> Pad[ 8661 0 8661 -10394 1969 0 10000 "1" >> "1" 0x00000100] #segment 1 >> Pad[ 8661 -10394 18504 -10394 1969 0 10000 "1" >> "1" 0x00000100] #segment 2 >> Pad[ 18504 -10394 18504 0 1969 0 10000 "1" >> "1" 0x00000100] #segment 3 >> Pad[ 18504 0 27165 0 1969 0 10000 "1" >> "1" 0x00000100] #segment 4 >> Pad[ 27165 0 27165 -15512 1969 0 10000 "1" >> "1" 0x00000100] #segment 5 >> # left side from origin >> Pad[ 0 0 0 -10394 1969 0 10000 "1" >> "1" 0x00000100] #segment 6 >> Pad[ 0 -10394 -9843 -10394 1969 0 10000 "1" >> "1" 0x00000100] #segment 7 >> Pad[-9843 -10394 -9843 0 1969 0 10000 "1" >> "1" 0x00000100] #segment 8 >> Pad[-9843 0 -27559 0 1969 0 10000 "1" >> "1" 0x00000100] #segment 9 >> Pad[-18504 -787 -18504 -19281 1969 0 10000 "1" >> "1" 0x00000100] #segment 10 >> Pad[-26772 -787 -26772 -18504 3543 0 10000 "2" >> "2" 0x00000100] #segment 11 >> #silk lines >> ElementLine[-30197 2559 29725 2559 700] #top >> ElementLine[ 29725 2559 29725 -18307 700] #right >> ElementLine[-30118 2559 -30118 -18307 700] #left >> ElementLine[-30118 -18307 -29724 -18307 700] #bottom starting >> from left >> ElementLine[-23798 -18307 -20678 -18307 700] #segment between >> vertical pieces >> ElementLine[-16318 -18307 29564 -18307 700] #right-most segeme= nt >> ) >> # antenna layout >> # >> # * =3D origin >> # -------s9-- *--s0--- ----s4--| >> # | | | | | | | >> # | | s8 s6 s1 s3 | >> # | | | | | | s5 >> # s11 | |---s7---| |---s2--- | >> # | | | >> # | s10 | >> # | | | >> # | | >> # >> >> >> > --000000000000fe1a5605ae631972 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
There are two other things to know for these sorts of app= lications

1) inkscape2pcb now = exports (v0.92 inkscape) simple polygons to pcb-rnd footprints, as well as = paths, allowing application note designs like this to be converted fairly e= asily from source documents to copper polygons. Footprints can then be scal= ed in x, y or both directions in pcb-rnd too.


2) pstoedit can do similar exports of postscript featu= res to pcb layouts, and the next release should include code for a plugin t= hat exports polygons to pcb-rnd footprints.



The look and feel = is much the same for pcb-rnd vs PCB, but keyboard shortcuts have had to evo= lve to keep up with the features.

Regards,

Erich=


On Thu, 3 Sep 2020 15:16 Roger Traylor (<= a href=3D"mailto:traylor AT engr DOT orst DOT edu" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noreferrer= ">traylor AT engr DOT orst DOT edu) [via geda-help AT delorie DOT com], <ged= a-help AT delorie DOT com> wrote:
<= div style=3D"word-wrap:break-word;line-break:after-white-space">Erich,
=
Thanks for the info. I figured pcb-rnd could probably handle this = situation.

Right now however, I need to get a job = done.=C2=A0 I=E2=80=99d like to try pcb-rnd as I've
followed = the development for a while but it feels like the =E2=80=9Ctrain has left t= he=C2=A0
station=E2=80=9D as far as I=E2=80=99m concerned. It loo= ks daunting to get started with and I
see no on-ramp for beginner= s. Maybe for the next project.

Thanks again,
=
Roger

On Sep 2, 2020, at 4:= 37 PM, Erich Heinzle (a1039181 AT gmail DOT com) [via geda-help AT delorie DOT com] <geda-help AT delorie DOT com>= wrote:

pcb-rnd allows polygons within= footprint elements, as well as lines and arcs, which, in combination with = terminals, can produce the sorts of structures you are playing with more ea= sily.

Importantly, there is al= so an "intnoconn" attribute that can be used on copper features w= ithin the footprint


=
That can be used, for example within a pcb spiral inducto= r, so that the copper does not look like a short across the terminals.

With the gEDA PCB footprint = data model, you will have to paint the features with pads, will end up with= a short with DRC, and will have a limited ability to manipulate the solder= mask over the features, if needed.


Regards,

Erich

On Thu, 3 Sep 2020 08:43 Roger Traylor (traylor AT engr DOT orst DOT edu) [via geda-help AT delorie DOT com],= <geda-help AT delorie DOT com> wrote:
Gang,
A quick question for PCB gurus:

I have a =E2=80=9Cfolded F=E2=80=9D antenna for 2.4Ghz.=C2=A0 It has one= open end, one input for the signal
and one matching stub that is= to be connected to ground.

I drew this in PCB as = a series of =E2=80=9Cpads=E2=80=9D. I attempted to make one pad =E2=80=9C1= =E2=80=9D =C2=A0the input,
and pad =E2=80=9C2=E2=80=9D as ground.= =C2=A0gschem did not complain about the symbol, but PCB complains=C2=A0
about not being able to find pad "2" (the ground pin).=C2= =A0

Could this be because PCB sees all the pads ov= erlapping as one pad?=C2=A0 If so, how can
I overcome this proble= m?

Thanks,
Roger Traylor

<= /div>
Footprint file is below:

Element[0x00000000 "" "= ;" "" 0 0 0 0 0 100 0x00000000]
#Flipped Meander antenna for CC2500 = =C2=A0
#R.= Traylor 7.27.2020
#50 ohm feed point is at end of segment 10
#requires via to ground plane at = bottom of segment 11
#silk at bottom marks the edge of the ground plane
<= div>#see TI/Chipcon Applica= tion Note AN043
#This is the flipped version of the original meander antenna
#
(
# =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0X1 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Y1 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 X2 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0 Y2 =C2=A0 =C2=A0thick =C2=A0clear =C2=A0mask =C2=A0name numb =C2=A0 = =C2=A0 =C2=A0 flag
# right side from origin
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Pad[ =C2=A0 =C2=A00 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0 =C2=A0 =C2=A08661 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01= 969 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0 =C2=A0 10000 =C2=A0 "1" =C2=A0"1" 0= x00000100] =C2=A0#segment 0
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Pad[ 8661 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 0 =C2=A0 =C2=A08661 =C2=A0 -10394 =C2=A0 1969 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0 =C2=A0 10= 000 =C2=A0 "1" =C2=A0"1" 0x00000100] =C2=A0#segment 1
=C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Pad[ 8661 =C2=A0 -10394 =C2=A018504 =C2=A0 -10394 =C2=A0 = 1969 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0 =C2=A0 10000 =C2=A0 "1" =C2=A0"1" = 0x00000100] =C2=A0#segment 2
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Pad[ 18504 =C2=A0-10394 =C2= =A018504 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01969 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0 =C2=A0 10= 000 =C2=A0 "1" =C2=A0"1" 0x00000100] =C2=A0#segment 3
=C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Pad[ 18504 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A00 =C2=A0 27165 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01969 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0 =C2=A0 10000 =C2=A0 "1&= quot; =C2=A0"1" 0x00000100] =C2=A0#segment 4
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Pa= d[ 27165 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A00 =C2=A0 27165 =C2=A0 -15512 =C2=A0 1969 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 0 =C2=A0 10000 =C2=A0 "1" =C2=A0"1" 0x000001= 00] =C2=A0#segment 5
# left side from origin =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0=C2=A0
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Pad[ =C2=A0 =C2=A00 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0 = =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0 =C2=A0 -10394 =C2=A0 1969 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0 =C2=A0 100= 00 =C2=A0 "1" =C2=A0"1" 0x00000100] =C2=A0#segment 6
=C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Pad[ =C2=A0 =C2=A00 =C2=A0 -10394 =C2=A0-9843 =C2=A0 -103= 94 =C2=A0 1969 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0 =C2=A0 10000 =C2=A0 "1" =C2=A0&quo= t;1" 0x00000100] =C2=A0#segment 7
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Pad[-9843 =C2=A0 -= 10394 =C2=A0-9843 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01969 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0 = =C2=A0 10000 =C2=A0 "1" =C2=A0"1" 0x00000100] =C2=A0#se= gment 8
= =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Pad[-9843 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0 =C2=A0-27559 = =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01969 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0 =C2=A0 10000 =C2= =A0 "1" =C2=A0"1" 0x00000100] =C2=A0#segment 9
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 Pad[-18504 =C2=A0 =C2=A0-787 -18504 =C2=A0 -19281 =C2=A0 1969 = =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0 =C2=A0 10000 =C2=A0 "1" =C2=A0"1" 0x000= 00100] =C2=A0#segment 10
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Pad[-26772 =C2=A0 =C2=A0-787 -26= 772 =C2=A0 -18504 =C2=A0 3543 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0 =C2=A0 10000 =C2=A0 "2&q= uot; =C2=A0"2" 0x00000100] =C2=A0#segment 11
#silk lines
<= font face=3D"Courier" style=3D"font-size:12px">=C2=A0 =C2=A0ElementLine[-30= 197 =C2=A02559 =C2=A029725 =C2=A0 2559 =C2=A0700] =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 #top=
=C2=A0 = =C2=A0ElementLine[ 29725 =C2=A02559 =C2=A029725 =C2=A0-18307 =C2=A0700] =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0#right
=C2=A0 =C2=A0ElementLine[-30118 =C2=A02559 -30118 =C2=A0-1830= 7 =C2=A0700] =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0#left
=C2=A0 =C2=A0ElementLine[-30118 =C2=A0-18307 -= 29724 =C2=A0-18307 =C2=A0700] =C2=A0 =C2=A0#bottom starting from left
=C2=A0 =C2=A0El= ementLine[-23798 =C2=A0-18307 -20678 =C2=A0-18307 =C2=A0700] =C2=A0 =C2=A0#= segment between vertical pieces
=C2=A0 =C2=A0ElementLine[-16318 =C2=A0-18307 =C2=A029= 564 =C2=A0-18307 =C2=A0700] =C2=A0 =C2=A0#right-most segement
<= div>)
# antenna layout
#
# * =3D origin
= # =C2=A0 =C2=A0 -------s9--= =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0*--s0--- =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 ----s4--|<= /div>
# =C2=A0 =C2=A0 |= =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 |
# =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0= | =C2=A0 s8 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 s6 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0s1 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 s3= =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 |
# =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0= =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0s5
#= =C2=A0 =C2=A0s11 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0|---s7---| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0|---= s2--- =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 |
# =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0|
# =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 s10 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 |
# =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0|
# =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0|
#



--000000000000fe1a5605ae631972--