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Subject: Re: DJGPP and Vista/64-bit
From: "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have AT bitfoad DOT cmm>
Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2006 05:59:48 -0500
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"Alexei A. Frounze" <alexfru AT chat DOT ru> wrote in message
news:6_OdnQRIt-7nVOrYnZ2dnUVZ_qadnZ2d AT comcast DOT com...
> Blair Campbell wrote:
> > On 12/6/06, Alexei A. Frounze <alexfru AT chat DOT ru> wrote:
> >> So, what's the DJGPP's future under Vista and 64-bit Windows?
> >>
> > Hey yeah, are 32-bit DOS apps able to run under 64-bit Windows?  I
> > know 16-bit apps can't.
> >
> They can't for two reasons:
> - there's no any kind of DOS, which they need for all I/O
> - they start as 16-bit DOS apps anyway and only after that switch to
32-bit
> mode
>
> I guess the only way to go would be to do the following:
> - build DJGPP as win32 apps so it can run under windows (maybe just like
> Open Watcom -- it essentially has 2 toolsets)
> - (cross-)compile code for DOS, so that the DOS applications can still be
> compiled, even though can't always be executed
> - provide source-level compatibility (where possible) so that some DOS
> applications can be compiled into functionally (nearly-)identical win32
> apps -- everything that explicitly deals with DOS interrupts and special
> memory locations (BIOS data area) will have to go. Some things (like
console
> I/O) will probably be possible. I wonder if it's possible to make a few
> functions so that the direct graphical output (either to a window or to
the
> entire screen) just like in DOS...
>

Alexei,

As you know I use DOS toolchains.  But, I think DOS code development and
toolchains have seen a huge decrease since Gates officially declared DOS to
be dead with the release of XP in late 2001.  Since then, except for some of
the early internet DOS archives, DOS sites and code are disappearing like a
forest on fire...  Those that haven't converted to XP have gone to Linux.

I doubt that most DOS toolchains will advance much further.  Multi-platform
toolchains like OW will continue to advance but not in the DOS area.  To use
DOS toolchains in the future, one will probably have to look into creating a
full DOS emulation environment.  My thoughts for a 64-bit ""DOS"" would be
to start with a 32-bit C based partial emulator like DOSBOX and push it to
the next level by combining it with any additional or missing components and
emulation, such as DPMI or SB audio, from FreeDOS-32, QEMU, and/or DOSEMU,
FreeDOS, etc.

You're questions about Vista on a few NGs brings up an interesting point
that I've been wanting to discuss.  Do you think that long term Linux can
compete against Microsoft given the small amount of capital available to
Linux versus MS (7 Billion on Vista alone...) and the continuing rapid
change or advancement in PC hardware?
(I'm not sure if DJ wants this discussed here.  If he complains, I'll catch
your reply if you post to alt.os.development.)


Rod Pemberton