Message-ID: <35C81262.CA3C67F6@geocities.com> From: Merlin MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: comp.os.msdos.djgpp Subject: Re: allegro == or != programming References: <3 DOT 0 DOT 1 DOT 32 DOT 19980804003438 DOT 007a9b10 AT adinet DOT com DOT uy> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 125 Date: Wed, 05 Aug 1998 08:08:19 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 184-cy-wpg.ilos.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 05 Aug 1998 03:08:19 CDT Organization: MBnet Networking Inc. To: djgpp AT delorie DOT com DJ-Gateway: from newsgroup comp.os.msdos.djgpp Precedence: bulk lubaldo AT adinet DOT com DOT uy wrote: > Hello. I personally think that this discussion is a bit off topic but I > think that lot of people are learning here so they are interested... sorry > to answer to this thread if you think it is off topic... but is an > interesant discussion for some people and it is DJGPP-Allegro related > anyway... > > My personal opinions: > > Everyone has to start learning from something easy. Many people that > learns, want to do visual thinks and not only text based programs... so > what: they are learning, but they cant do complex things like hardware > access and manipulation, so they have to use a library and Allegro is very > powerfull and easy at the same time! true allegro is good for learning... quite good. > > > I have started to learn C with M$ C/C++ 7.0 (not visual)... that compiler > is ugly. > In that time I didn't have a modem and a good graphics library (the M$ one > was very slow). So, started to do my own... started with VGA 320x200... > then VESA 1.2 in 8bpp... but it was very SLOW and coded in C only... but no > matter of that I have learned... > Then I have got a modem and downloaded DJGPP... then Allegro... and > subscribed to this newsgroup... > After that time, I have learned much more faster than before and I have > learned what I think are more usefull things (for what I want to be or try > to be) than understanding how VESA 1.2 works... > > If someone wants to be a game programmer, it has to start learning the > basics of game programming, it has to learn how to structure very good a > game, it has to learn good C, etc. But I think that hardware programming > isn't a very good start... it will not teach you very much of C, it will > not teach you very much of structured programming or AI. If you are very > good at hardware programming and not good at game programming, if you do a > game, you will end with a game that has a good technology and good frame > rate but is not fun and not good in what it has to do. If you are very good > at game programming but not in hardware, you can do a good game no matter > of that. true i suppose an opinion would be based on what the person is actually trying to do.. > > > If someone wants to be a hardware programmer or engines/libraries > programmer, it has to learn good C and assembly and if it wants to do 3d it > has to learn very good mathematics, and it has to do its own grafix library > and such... But because you have to learn good C and if you want to do > visual programming and not only text based... Allegro comes again as a good > choice to start learning. > > So, I think that there are 2 choices to take... or if you want to be or > learn the 2 things, I think it is better to start from the 1st one (using > other's libs) and then follow with the 2nd one, after you learn how to > program very good. > > > So, I think Merlin, that if you are a good programmer and you like > hardware programming, you have to do your own libraries, because that will > teach you more. But if you want to be a game programmer only... maybe it is > not necessary to go that far... anyway if you go that far you will learn > more, but doing your libraries as the first step is not good, learn how to > program good and then do the libraries. Anyway, at the university they > teach how to code hardware (Ok, I also think that it is better to learn by > hobby than in the university, since if you learn by your own, you learn > faster and better...) and I think that if someone codes and is learning for > hobby, it has to do what it wants to do, if you don't want to do a graphic > library or want to do other things first, then do that things and not do > the library and leave that part for more in advance. > > > Also, if someone does a game with Allegro and lot of others libs, that no > matters, it has done the GAME, thats not easy (depends on the game) and if > the game is good, it is showing a good skill of the programmer of that game. > Shawn has done Allegro, and OK, that shows that Shawn has a good skill. > But that doesn't mean that Shawn can do good games (I am taking that as an > example, Shawn actually DOES good games). > So, both examples shows different skills on different things but that > doesn't mean that Shawn is better programmer than that game programmer or > that that game programmer is a better programmer than Shawn; they are good > in what they do. > So, if you do a game using lots of libs, you don't have to feel like a bad > programmer. this is right... no matter what you do it still requires skill. > > > If you do a good game and a good library... you are a very good programmer > indeed. But remember: time is short... would you have time to do both > things? Do something like Allegro takes a lot of work and time and do a > good game also needs time and work... > > Ok, that are my opinions to share with anyone. You may think different. > This is to discuss only and arrive to some conclusion or never arrive to > some conclusion but maybe this will serve to see that actually many people > thinks different but no one has all the reason. Thanks for your opinion... it was quite interesting.. Merlin. > Finally: sorry to post a so big semi-offtopic or totally-offtopic letter... > > > Goodbye! > > Ivan Baldo: > lubaldo AT adinet DOT com DOT uy - http://members.xoom.com/baldo - ICQ 10215364 > Phone: (598) (2) 613 3223. > Caldas 1781, Malvin, Montevideo, Uruguay, South America. > > (If you have problems with the previous addresses, try this ones: > ibaldo AT usa DOT net, http://baldo.home.ml.org).