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Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2002 19:09:44 -0500
From: Charles Wilson <cwilson AT ece DOT gatech DOT edu>
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To: Joshua Daniel Franklin <joshuadfranklin AT yahoo DOT com>
CC: cygwin-apps AT cygwin DOT com
Subject: Re: pager in default install
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Joshua Daniel Franklin wrote:

>>That's because I didn't use this list.  I had another criteria which,
>>if you are looking in the email archives, you should be able to see
>>mentioned a few times.  I used the 'base' category from debian.  Hopefully
>>we haven't drifted from that too much.
>>
> 
> I remember something about that but thought it was just a general 
> guideline. I installed Debian with the Potato netinst CD
> http://www.debian.org/CD/netinst/
> and guess what's in 'base'? "util-linux" including 'more'
> http://packages.debian.org/stable/base/util-linux.html
> 
> So what does this mean for more's inclusion?

Not arguing for or against, here, but as a point of order:

util-linux IS what cgf is worried about cygutils BECOMING: a catch all 
for lots and lots of stuff -- some important, some not.  util-linux 
contains (among other things):

/bin/arch
/bin/dmesg
/bin/kill
/bin/login
/bin/more
/etc/fdprm
/etc/pam.d/chfn
/etc/pam.d/chsh
/etc/pam.d/kbdrate
/etc/pam.d/login
/etc/security/console.apps/kbdrate
/sbin/agetty
/sbin/blockdev
/sbin/clock
/sbin/ctrlaltdel
/sbin/elvtune
/sbin/fdisk
/sbin/fsck.minix
/sbin/hwclock
/sbin/kbdrate
/sbin/mkfs
/sbin/mkfs.bfs
/sbin/mkfs.minix
/sbin/mkswap
/sbin/nologin
/sbin/pivot_root
/sbin/rescuept
/sbin/sfdisk
/usr/bin/cal
/usr/bin/chfn
/usr/bin/chsh
/usr/bin/col
/usr/bin/colcrt
/usr/bin/colrm
/usr/bin/column
/usr/bin/cytune
/usr/bin/ddate
/usr/bin/fdformat
/usr/bin/getopt
/usr/bin/hexdump
/usr/bin/ipcrm
/usr/bin/ipcs
/usr/bin/logger
/usr/bin/look
/usr/bin/mcookie
/usr/bin/mkcramfs
/usr/bin/namei
/usr/bin/newgrp
/usr/bin/raw
/usr/bin/rename
/usr/bin/renice
/usr/bin/rev
/usr/bin/script
/usr/bin/setfdprm
/usr/bin/setsid
/usr/bin/setterm
/usr/bin/ul
/usr/bin/whereis
/usr/bin/write
/usr/games/banner
/usr/sbin/cfdisk
/usr/sbin/hwclock
/usr/sbin/ramsize
/usr/sbin/rdev
/usr/sbin/readprofile
/usr/sbin/rootflags
/usr/sbin/tunelp
/usr/sbin/vidmode
/usr/sbin/vigr
/usr/sbin/vipw

Now, surely 'kill' and 'login' are BASE programs, but 'newgrp'?  Sure, 
it's useful, but the system is completely functional without 'newgrp'. 
And 'ddate' -- fun but hardly necessary.  'cal', 'col', 'banner'? Ditto.

But, since the machine is pretty much useless without 'login' (and 
perhaps the pam modules) -- the whole thing gets classified as BASE.

Splitting things up into separate packages is good.  That way, the 
'login' program can be classified as BASE (as it is in cygwin, since we 
have a 'login' package containing....'login'!) but ddate and cal can go 
live in the unimportant (but fun and useful) cygutils package.

(The argument could be made that everything in cygutils should be split 
into individual packages, but SOME conglomeration is okay.  We just need 
to be reasonable about it)

Now, back to the topic: more.  Just because util-linux is classified as 
BASE by Debian, and we want to follow (within reason) Debian's category 
scheme, it does not NECESSARILY follow that every program WITHIN 
util-linux should ALSO be a 'base' package -- by splitting things up we 
have more flexibility.  ('more' might be 'base'able -- but not merely on 
the basis of util-linux's position in the Debian category scheme).

--Chuck