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Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2016 22:07:58 +0300
From: Andrey Repin <anrdaemon AT yandex DOT ru>
Reply-To: cygwin AT cygwin DOT com
Message-ID: <1117668279.20160414220758@yandex.ru>
To: Warren Young <wyml AT etr-usa DOT com>, cygwin AT cygwin DOT com
Subject: Re: native Linux userland in Windows 10
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Greetings, Warren Young!

>> I do not think they have really considered the integration issues that Cygwin
>> has mostly solved.

> Since when has Microsoft ever been immune from NIH syndrome?

>> small things like cygpath

> A cygpath like facility is neither useful nor needed in UfW.  The programs
> run in their own Ubuntu world, and can’t talk to native Windows .exes
> directly.  The only access to Windows paths is through /mnt/c and such. 
> Within the UfW world, there are only POSIX paths.

Which means, I can't call diff between files on my file manager's two panels?

>> Remember, they have tried basically the same thing at least twice before: the
>> "POSIX Subsystem" of WinNT

> Yes, and this is another such subsystem, with the same powers and limitations.

> The big difference this time is that it isn’t a gimped bare-bones POSIX
> subsystem, it’s a gimped Ubuntu subsystem.  Ubuntu with severe limitations
> is still highly useful; witness Raspian.

Raspian is an operating system.
This… this, I don't know how to call it, but it's a complete joke.

> A concrete example: All those soul-patch web developers choose to carry Mac
> laptops not just because they’re the hipster choice, but because Node runs
> much better under OS X than Windows.  That proposition wholly changes in
> this UfW world: run node.js in the Ubuntu box and connect to it over the
> OS’s shared network stack from the Windows GUI browser of your choice.

At the same time, you could run any given VM and get much better options and
choices.

> Microsoft must be getting mighty sick of seeing rows and rows of Apple
> logos on laptops in the audiences at the Build conference every year.  UfW
> is one way they’re trying to change that.

>> I'll give it a year or two to settle

> I expect it to be quite usable in a matter of months.  Microsoft can move
> awfully fast once the fires get lit.

I wouldn't be so hasty. If there's no interfacing between subsystems, it is as
useful as running a VM. Read: useless crap, when it is going to usability.

>> I just hope it does not interfere too much with my Cygwin setup

> UfW will be completely independent of Cygwin.
> More’s the pity, because it means you’ll be incentivized to choose one or
> the other, likely to Cygwin’s net detriment.

Since it will be independent of Windows as well as Cygwin, the choice is a
nobrainer.


-- 
With best regards,
Andrey Repin
Thursday, April 14, 2016 21:54:53

Sorry for my terrible english...