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From: "David Christensen" <dpchrist AT holgerdanske DOT com>
To: <cygwin AT cygwin DOT com>
Subject: RE: Request for a version/ revision/ release number for the whole Cygwin release/ distribution
Date: Sat, 2 Oct 2004 00:03:09 -0700
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In-Reply-To: <200410010531.i915VL1a014777@a.mail.sonic.net>

cygwin AT cygwin DOT com:

Thank you all for your replies thus far.  I suspected that my posting
would generate traffic.  :-)


> I would especially like to request that there be a "stable"
distribution.

This wish was inspired by my positive experiences with Debian "stable"
-- e.g. feature frozen, unit and integration tested, with updates
limited to bug and security fixes.


Please note that Debian is a volunteer effort:

	http://www.debian.org/devel/join/

If they can do it, I bet we can too.


> 1.  I use Cygwin for ... mission-critical backup chores.

I don't use Cygwin at customer sites; it's failed me on my personal
systems so I can't risk it on client machines.  I view this as a huge
waste of potential.


I do not have the knowledge or resources to do unit and integration
testing of (a subset of) Cygwin.  I believe the task to be too big for
any one person.  So, let's all cooperate -- many hands make light work.


> I was recently bitten by the cron-2.6.2 EOF issue ...

correction -- rsync-2.6.2 EOL issue.


> ... integration testing of Cygwin as a whole. ...

Has anybody else noticed that software engineers tend to "forget"
testing, while hardware engineers consider it mandatory?  Every software
engineer should take a Verilog (or VHDL) class and be converted, as was
I.  Both my software development process and the end result have
improved greatly since I began writing software and its test suite
concurrently.


I do understand that creating a good integration test suite is a
substantial and never-ending undertaking.  Furthermore, "testing does
not prove correctness" -- the game is "how many 9's can you achieve for
the given resources?".  That said, little or no testing is not the
correct answer.  Every complex system needs integration testing.  The
Cygwin library and package developers are in the best position to create
the first draft integration test suite(s) for their work(s).  From
there, testing needs to be done by "second pairs of eyes", with ongoing
developer coordination and support, to get the maximum benefit (e.g.
correctness).  So, each developer needs to be paired up with one or more
testers.


Unfortunately, software developer is commonly viewed as the hot, sexy
role while software tester is commonly viewed as the menial, expendable
role.  Fortunately, there are still people, such as myself, who
appreciate and enjoy the test role.  Perhaps this is where my volunteer
offer can be first applied.  Their may be others of similar ilk lurking
on this list, waiting for the opportunity.


> ... I would like to be able to burn Cygwin X.Y.Z onto a CD or DVD ...

Actually, I have already copied my Cygwin package tree to a CD for
installing on other computers.  I need to review the Cygwin license to
see if a third-party distribution is allowed.


> p.s.  I hereby volunteer my time to work on implementing my request.

I'm still waiting to hear from somebody "in authority".  Do I need to
post to cygwin-developers and/or cygwin-apps?

	http://www.cygwin.com/faq/faq_3.html#SEC25


I understand that cannot possibly lead the effort to achieve my request;
I don't have the skills or the time.  I'm looking for a part-time
position under the guidance of a leader who can mastermind a solution
and feed me pieces to build and/or test.  My skill set includes C, Make,
Perl, RCS/CVS, web programming, database programming, Unix systems
programming, Unix and Windows system administration, etc.:

	http://www.holgerdanske.com/dpchrist/


David


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