From: jqb AT netcom DOT com (Jim Balter) Subject: Re: ASCII and BINARY files. Why? 1 Feb 1997 04:22:26 -0800 Approved: cygnus DOT gnu-win32 AT cygnus DOT com Distribution: cygnus Message-ID: <32F2E0A7.527C.cygnus.gnu-win32@netcom.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) Original-To: Grant Leslie Original-CC: GNU-WIN32 Original-Sender: owner-gnu-win32 AT cygnus DOT com Grant Leslie wrote: > > > From: Jim Balter > > You have to accept *some* sort of imperfection. The argument that > users > > shouldn't be made to convert files is useless when the alternative > is > > that no tool can be used for both text and binary files. > > I for one would rather work to remove any sort of imperfections I had > the ability to remove... Sigh. That's a non sequitur. If you think not, let's see your plans for making everybody happy. > > Loose talk about "the average Win95 user", a person who would have > no > > interest in these tools, ignores the other end, average and not so > > average users who are familiar with these tools and want to fully > take > > advantage of their capabilities. > > These development tools are intended to develop software... This > software which is created WILL eventually be placed in the hands of > non-developers. Shouldn't every effort be made to remove as many > idiosyncrasies as possible _before_ that happens?? From what I've > read quite a few people would like to make money with the end > products. Sigh. A house does not resemble the tools it was built with. The facts that od doesn't show \r's or that typing echo a|tr a '\032|wc prints 0 0 0 will not be reflected in developed products. A developer can read or write files any way she wants (and frankly, any developer that writes a product that doesn't always use binary opens to avoid any surprises is nutso). The text/binary issue only involves the *default* for file processing, which is mostly a problem for source that you cannot or do not wish to modify. It has to do with development time and portability. These are not end-user concerns, except to the degree that they are reflected in product cost and availability. > I don't know exactly what Cygnus envisions for these tools, yet Im > rather certain the companies they work with will be wanting them to > create software for people other than just the software developers in > that company. The tools themselves are not the end to the means.... No, tools are means, not ends, which is exactly why the issues here only affect developers, not end users, and why "the average Win95 user" is irrelevant. -- - For help on using this list, send a message to "gnu-win32-request AT cygnus DOT com" with one line of text: "help".