Mail Archives: opendos/2001/02/05/03:14:45
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----- Original Message -----=20
From: Paul Hysen=20
To: opendos AT delorie DOT com=20
Sent: Sunday, February 04, 2001 10:17 PM
Subject: VAT32, DR-DOS 7.03, Dos progs,etc.
Can anyone help. I recently upgraded to a 10 Gig drive and I found to =
my disappointment the limits of FAT 16, namely a maximum of 2 Gig =
partitions, and not being able to see the last 2 Gig of my drive due to =
it having a limitation to the number of cylinders it can see on a hard =
drive. It appears that in order to be able to get around this, I would =
have to convert to FAT 32.
Let me first make a few statements. First I do not use partitions =
larger than 255MB for FAT 16. When you use 256MB and larger partitions =
you eat up a lot of disk space from slack space. As you increase the =
size of a partition you also increase the cluster size. You waste an =
average of 1/2 cluster per file. If you have a cluster size of 64 =
sectors (32KB) you will waste 16KB per file on average. If you have =
10,000 files on a partiton that would waste about 160MB of drive space. =
It adds up very fast. That is why FAT 32 was created, to reduce the =
slack space wasted as well as alloing for larger drives.
Does anyone know whether DR-DOS 7.03 and NDO 3 works OK in FAT 32? If =
so, what about other DOS programs?
No it does not. There are drivers and utilities that can read FAT 32 =
and Long File Names (LFNs) but DOS program that read or write directly =
to the disk will not work and my damage a FAT 32. This does not mean =
that most programs will not work, but things like Norton Utilites and =
other such things that will write directly to the drive will not work. =
DOS utilities like CHKDSK will not work and probably a lot of other =
things will not work.
There is a OEM version of the Kernel files 7.04/05 put out by Ontrack =
that will work with FAT 32 much better than a FAT 32 driver and LFN =
drivers and/or utilities. But this version does have some bugs. =
Personally I don't trust DOS working with FAT 32 at all. WINDOZE makes =
enough of a mess and crashes enough by itself as well as trashing a FAT =
32 partition, I would not add to it by allowing DOS to write to a FAT 32 =
until someone determines that there is a stable option to do this.
Alternatively, would there be a problem in changing the Windows 98 =
partition (drive E:) to FAT 32 and leaving my DOS drives (C: & D:) in =
FAT 16?=20
Absolutely not, in fact this is exactly the way I do it. WINDOZE 98 =
will put it's kernel and boot files and a few other files it uses to =
install and log stuff to on drive C:, it will use something like 10MB to =
install and leave something like 3MB of files of drive C: WINDOZE will =
boot from C: to begin with then go to E: as though it was the root =
partition for WINDOZE. However, 95 has a bad habit of putting it's GRP =
files in the C: root directory, so after WINDOZE gets through loading =
all of it's crap, I move those files to the WINDOZE directory i.e. =
E:\WINDOWS or whatever you want to call it.
My computer boots from C: and I use System Commander on drive C: to =
switch between operating systems.
You can use DRDOS LOADER to do this. I no longer have 8x on my system =
but did it this way when I had it. I use NT now and will be putting =
Linux on shortly. My C: D: drive is an IDE 345MB with about 70MB as C: =
and 255MB as D: both are FAT 16. The second drive is a 3GB SCSI and the =
first partition is an ext2 Linux partition, the second is a 625 MB DOS =
primary partition ( I use this to download and store large files. The =
next is a 1GB FAT DOS primary which is also used to store large files. I =
am backing those up and will use that as another Linux partition when I =
install Linux. The next is an Extended partition. The first logical =
drive is a 144MB FAT 16, used for backups. The second logical is a 1GB =
which I use for NT and used for 9x. After I install Linux I will use =
LILO as myboot manager. I'll still probably leave LOADER installed and =
can set the appropriate boot partition with FDISK should an emergency =
occur with LILO and still boot from DOS or NT. At One time I had DOS, =
Linux and OS/2 on the system and used LILO as the boot manager and got =
rid of the OS/2 boot manager. The reason I will keep the DRDOS boot =
manager is because DOS FDISK plays musical chairs with the partition =
table even if the only thing you do is set the boot partition to another =
partition. DRDOS FDSIK from 7.03 does not seem to do this any more, But =
I won't take any chances on it.
Pat
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<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A href=3D"mailto:p_hysen AT merlin DOT net DOT au" =
title=3Dp_hysen AT merlin DOT net DOT au>Paul=20
Hysen</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A =
href=3D"mailto:opendos AT delorie DOT com"=20
title=3Dopendos AT delorie DOT com>opendos AT delorie DOT com</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, February 04, 2001 =
10:17=20
PM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> VAT32, DR-DOS 7.03, =
Dos=20
progs,etc.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Can anyone help. I recently =
upgraded to a 10=20
Gig drive and I found to my disappointment the limits of FAT 16, =
namely a=20
maximum of 2 Gig partitions, and not being able to see the last 2 Gig =
of my=20
drive due to it having a limitation to the number of cylinders it =
can see=20
on a hard drive. It appears that in order to be able to get around =
this, I=20
would have to convert to FAT 32.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><STRONG>Let me first make a few statements. First I do not use =
partitions=20
larger than 255MB for FAT 16. When you use 256MB and larger partitions =
you eat=20
up a lot of disk space from slack space. As you increase the size of a =
partition you also increase the cluster size. You waste an average of =
1/2=20
cluster per file. If you have a cluster size of 64 sectors (32KB) you =
will=20
waste 16KB per file on average. If you have 10,000 files on a partiton =
that=20
would waste about 160MB of drive space. It adds up very fast. That is =
why FAT=20
32 was created, to reduce the slack space wasted as well as alloing =
for larger=20
drives.</STRONG></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Does anyone know whether DR-DOS =
7.03 and NDO=20
3 works OK in FAT 32? If so, what about other DOS =
programs?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><STRONG>No it does not. There are drivers and utilities that can =
read FAT=20
32 and Long File Names (LFNs) but DOS program that read or write =
directly to=20
the disk will not work and my damage a FAT 32. This does not mean that =
most=20
programs will not work, but things like Norton Utilites and other such =
things=20
that will write directly to the drive will not work. DOS utilities =
like CHKDSK=20
will not work and probably a lot of other things will not =
work.</STRONG></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><STRONG>There is a OEM version of the Kernel files 7.04/05 put =
out by=20
Ontrack that will work with FAT 32 much better than a FAT 32 driver =
and LFN=20
drivers and/or utilities. But this version does have some bugs. =
Personally I=20
don't trust DOS working with FAT 32 at all. WINDOZE makes enough of a =
mess and=20
crashes enough by itself as well as trashing a FAT 32 partition, I =
would not=20
add to it by allowing DOS to write to a FAT 32 until someone =
determines that=20
there is a stable option to do this.</STRONG></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2> Alternatively, would =
there be a=20
problem in changing the Windows 98 partition (drive E:) to FAT 32 =
and=20
leaving my DOS drives (C: & D:) in FAT 16? </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><STRONG>Absolutely not, in fact this is exactly the way I do it. =
WINDOZE=20
98 will put it's kernel and boot files and a few other files it uses =
to=20
install and log stuff to on drive C:, it will use something like 10MB =
to=20
install and leave something like 3MB of files of drive C: WINDOZE will =
boot=20
from C: to begin with then go to E: as though it was the root =
partition for=20
WINDOZE. However, 95 has a bad habit of putting it's GRP files in the =
C: root=20
directory, so after WINDOZE gets through loading all of it's crap, I =
move=20
those files to the WINDOZE directory i.e. E:\WINDOWS or whatever you =
want to=20
call it.</STRONG></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>My computer boots from C: and I use =
System=20
Commander on drive C: to switch between operating =
systems.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>You can use DRDOS LOADER to do this. I no longer have 8x on my =
system but=20
did it this way when I had it. I use NT now and will be putting Linux =
on=20
shortly. My C: D: drive is an IDE 345MB with about 70MB as C: and =
255MB as D:=20
both are FAT 16. The second drive is a 3GB SCSI and the first =
partition is an=20
ext2 Linux partition, the second is a 625 MB DOS primary partition ( I =
use=20
this to download and store large files. The next is a 1GB FAT DOS =
primary=20
which is also used to store large files. I am backing those up and =
will use=20
that as another Linux partition when I install Linux. The next is an =
Extended=20
partition. The first logical drive is a 144MB FAT 16, used for =
backups. The=20
second logical is a 1GB which I use for NT and used for 9x. After I =
install=20
Linux I will use LILO as myboot manager. I'll still probably leave =
LOADER=20
installed and can set the appropriate boot partition with FDISK should =
an=20
emergency occur with LILO and still boot from DOS or NT. At One time I =
had=20
DOS, Linux and OS/2 on the system and used LILO as the boot manager =
and got=20
rid of the OS/2 boot manager. The reason I will keep the DRDOS boot =
manager is=20
because DOS FDISK plays musical chairs with the partition table even =
if the=20
only thing you do is set the boot partition to another partition. =
DRDOS FDSIK=20
from 7.03 does not seem to do this any more, But I won't take any =
chances on=20
it.</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Pat</STRONG></FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>
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