X-Authentication-Warning:	delorie.com: mail set sender to geda-user-bounces using -f
X-Recipient:	geda-user AT delorie DOT com
X-Original-DKIM-Signature:	v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
	d=gmail.com; s=20120113;
	h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to;
	bh=2A3PRdIgLKXhb+HIWsbjvuoGMOTybUM+h3xqslW0nmw=;
	b=T9RpAirCiFP07g0yWZDvk9h0rdgYGgNeYzlRB4Vtnw9SRuedx25n73oytDR37oDUkj
	A/OXI6ec7Pd+FNMcrmj7BfBfa6GklHvTN1KWAHmGLi9eQK3FY/Y4FYuO+neaYGGPWrg1
	ZLiio/ztxySHLXDCzbeqOkYv1WJAcOW8qaEvw2M5rN6d5EHXb9xblNOaUMqj1e2dBvVo
	OsgTwnWTm5hcKZpoPs8vuB3bCDlTAwPs5Dq0YIkvBKDqt5dGJarw+6pUjCeE8zLUQp0W
	SLfzA5jFiXQZhjqi5hEbqrIJneZ5fObgh+SPxNeEYXSQAlMW9U9IPcKTq0ZN1+OraZVx
	1geg==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature:	v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
	d=1e100.net; s=20130820;
	h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date
	:message-id:subject:to;
	bh=2A3PRdIgLKXhb+HIWsbjvuoGMOTybUM+h3xqslW0nmw=;
	b=NT3QWC28grtaGg8qv6hF+UB9fUtFJUiDwD8bjFr6Ukdc6T4lTIj5dQ2f453etMG7Tz
	Tl2cJRX6hKG1M5DpPwqjp3SjKg+1u33+pVSxMoKkPPZUnLHzu0EXyUwEokJ31JMkKS1g
	Wgn/fMHROo1mDB4t7BGBWVRg6w7rFKxMg8qC02X//4sr9Zmr0wYBFCq9fV+M8hPeudQj
	NRKXeNdZvaZn++ug7fcjtLJt/yxQ69XqaSXYsqcH1F7GuNy+MKcCCbAepzDesCDCsCfk
	S8VPhPFm8xrNoVWAlGHhiyhhFanEjh3YdV4PU0AU7r/m+EO14QvOLSukzTNHih8uPQTg
	A5Cg==
X-Gm-Message-State:	AE9vXwN7jvWHVZTuGdAESuUXqb3KqV0jIDBUqfh4E3CgydvpGrNjaeV2e/n4oTVSi9EKrQYzOr+VpAs0eflMzw==
X-Received:	by 10.25.211.15 with SMTP id k15mr2195470lfg.178.1472264441539;
	Fri, 26 Aug 2016 19:20:41 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version:	1.0
In-Reply-To:	<CAJZxidA6HoFMz=CJdOtx-QT5y6Fy4Lz0rcD78AUJnw_9MACSrw@mail.gmail.com>
References:	<CAM2RGhT_pQZ8CGGM6ECwDUwJHeo3UwDJ6d_7RtVWhxJBQ=K1tA AT mail DOT gmail DOT com>
	<57C09C3C DOT 7020708 AT xs4all DOT nl> <20160826171545 DOT 2bc54995 AT floyd DOT freeelectron DOT net> <CAJZxidA6HoFMz=CJdOtx-QT5y6Fy4Lz0rcD78AUJnw_9MACSrw AT mail DOT gmail DOT com>
From:	"Evan Foss (evanfoss AT gmail DOT com) [via geda-user AT delorie DOT com]" <geda-user AT delorie DOT com>
Date:	Sat, 27 Aug 2016 02:20:40 +0000
Message-ID:	<CAM2RGhSaGOT=7-kwe+jn=j_wFYBDNEiN6O0=c1snR_ez5ah6ag@mail.gmail.com>
Subject:	Re: [geda-user] Microwave PCB layout simulation or How to eat all
	your processing power in 3 easy steps
To:	gEDA users mailing list <geda-user AT delorie DOT com>
Reply-To:	geda-user AT delorie DOT com
Errors-To:	nobody AT delorie DOT com
X-Mailing-List:	geda-user AT delorie DOT com
X-Unsubscribes-To:	listserv AT delorie DOT com

On Fri, Aug 26, 2016 at 10:48 PM, Chad Parker
(parker DOT charles AT gmail DOT com) [via geda-user AT delorie DOT com]
<geda-user AT delorie DOT com> wrote:
> FWIW, this is something I've thought a lot about also. It would be very
> cool, but as with all simulation, to do it and get an answer out that
> actually resembles the real world is really hard. There are a lot of details
> that have to be taken into account, and then you have to make sure that your
> fab gets them all right too when you build the board. You can get maybe 10%
> variation in the dielectric constant of FR4, for example. PCB is not
> currently aware of many of those details, like board material, layer
> thickness, the amount of prepreg between the layers, etc. so you'd still
> have to add all that information in somewhere.
>
> I have a situation right now where I'm putting a couple of vias in close
> proximity to each other and counting on the parasitic capacitance to couple
> in a test signal. I'd love to be able to simulate and get an idea of what
> the capacitance actually is. I'll have to build and test it to really figure
> it out.
>
> BTW, you need more than just Hyperlynx to do this. You need the specific
> Hyperlynx 3D field solver module. My employer has licenses for MG, including
> Hyperlynx, but that module is licensed separately (I was just looking into
> this last week).
>
> I don't know much about gnucap, but it seems like in order to use it to
> simulate a PCB like this, you still need to be able to abstract a circuit
> model from the layout, and that's what the fancy, expensive programs do.

https://web.archive.org/web/20130830223605/http://lc.cray.com/

> --Chad
>
> On Fri, Aug 26, 2016 at 5:15 PM, al davis <ad252 AT freeelectron DOT net> wrote:
>>
>> On Fri, 26 Aug 2016 21:45:00 +0200
>> "Bert Timmerman (bert DOT timmerman AT xs4all DOT nl) [via geda-user AT delorie DOT com]"
>> <geda-user AT delorie DOT com> wrote:
>> > So basically you wish for a Hyperlynx exporter for pcb ;-)
>>
>> Good luck getting Mentor (owner of Hyperlynx) to do that.
>>
>> What you really need is an exporter to gnucap-Verilog, or a plugin for
>> gnucap to read (and write) the pcb format.
>>
>> If somebody wants to write that gnucap plugin, I will help you do it.
>>
>



-- 
Home
http://evanfoss.googlepages.com/
Work
http://forge.abcd.harvard.edu/gf/project/epl_engineering/wiki/

-----BEGIN PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK-----
Version: GnuPG v2
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=Ta4p
-----END PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK-----

- Raw text -