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To:	geda-user AT delorie DOT com
Subject:	Re: [geda-user] Tyring to build this on wheezy, fails
Date:	Thu, 14 Apr 2016 00:21:56 -0400
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Reply-To:	geda-user AT delorie DOT com

On Wednesday 13 April 2016 23:24:00 gedau AT igor2 DOT repo DOT hu wrote:

> On Wed, 13 Apr 2016, Gene Heskett (gheskett AT shentel DOT net) [via 
geda-user AT delorie DOT com] wrote:
> > Somewhat, as it helps to explain that as old as this project is, it
> > is still suffering from teething problems. ;-)
>
> I think it's not like "still suffering". The project has some
> tamagotchi-like dependencies: autotools, gtk, guile. These are huge,
> ever-changing deps which require projects to be constantly upgraded
> just to keep the projects compilable.

There is definitely that too.

> If the project can't employ a bunch of programmers who are always
> ready to track these changes in the deps and add new
> code/fixes/hacks/workarounds in the project to statisfy the deps,
> there will be new problems from time to time.

The keyword in the free software arena is "employ".  That word can cost 
real money that this project quite likely doesn't have.  The project 
that can afford to employ someone on a full time basis is rare indeed.

Grants, often from people who need a new feature and are willing to 
underwrite the new features coding work, often quite well and for an 
extended period of time that is often required to make the new feature 
both functional, and to have that person around while the code is going 
thru the first year of use so all of us "ingenious idiots" can find and 
point out the unexpected gotchas that always pop up in the first year of 
the codes regular use.  The net result is that the company paying the 
coder gets a faster product to drive their own machines as well as the 
free linuxcnc also gaining that code.  The diff is that the supporting 
company writes their own even prettier front end for what is the heart 
on LCNC.

> If said deps have more 
> programmers and evolve faster, you get more of these problems over
> time. So I believe this is not a problem that "still exists" but
> rather something that is going to be more and more relevant as geda
> programmer team doesn't grow much while the codebase of those
> dependencies do.

If grants can be obtained to pay these people seems like nearly the only 
way to keep up.  But negotiating the grant can also take time better put 
to a different use.

> One of the reasons I said good bye to autotools in pcb-rnd. Short term
> effect: I could do large scale changes (e.g. convert big parts of the
> code to plugins, including the HIDs) that touched the build system
> much faster. I could concentrate on the actual job instead of fighting
> autotools. Long term effect: I don't need to constantly spend time and
> add code just to keep the current level of service.

A worthwhile goal indeed.

While I am a firm believer in re-usable code, if that code is not yours, 
and its a moving target all the time, then it does surely need to go in 
favor of writing your own often leaner code to replace it.  And my now 
ancient Woolrich western hat will get tipped in respect to those that do 
it.

> Regards,
>
> Igor2

To you too, Igor2 & take care.

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>

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