X-Authentication-Warning:	delorie.com: mail set sender to geda-user-bounces using -f
X-Recipient:	geda-user AT delorie DOT com
X-Original-DKIM-Signature:	v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
	d=gmail.com; s=20120113;
	h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to;
	bh=D7zglvoZOsF71GMBuF1Z/WlwODI5TMaVO/BYfjsDx0I=;
	b=N63ch32wW4xMyWZlUk6G7GePb1tLIGvAv/J7zgO7LgwIXQ1x6uoGjPBd5enc7RfRmX
	vjJHs5l2pX3qS+qfB02yAo639kSu2AdmI4wTpyAslmMWKxHEL3VMezK1b2a5GmJlMwl/
	MowHw01FbsOfoLY61omBZcfJcgjjgOaxqhPfhgqQYICudV3djv7lZ8cu5l78QxTU++ii
	WpoygjHkD28pc+T+BdWxdr9Y6V2dZTCs23jjt5t0X1eGhEY44X21mfelJFaCIRHHGmH/
	pF4Zf8mrdBCpgStGR3aIf8XJhO78LJXN3Ytq6mzAnDaIxCfCDjMyXDBv4NRzG3Rvz2rw
	FSwA==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature:	v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
	d=1e100.net; s=20130820;
	h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date
	:message-id:subject:from:to;
	bh=D7zglvoZOsF71GMBuF1Z/WlwODI5TMaVO/BYfjsDx0I=;
	b=UuGUeIGqcFeb7pqs5XtgNoHIbMxE0QQfAa7/3ZlqkJJhBbZZtvQBGh5jXCg5Z/Ouyl
	RiW3gxd3HgBcnXTJxMRrj+QPsDw3wsrdaeBVpm5ONJOcH9yHOQxBTKvz2hx9MYvhBFKB
	pQDHfKppRgaAvbWeHGM6uHd1miiFYZJxttYwpdc77aW1m/BeB6mNus3njyJPmsskHNY0
	A8a65OgE1t14NuiSA5KlmGijMf+khRNB+DCBKYOZyT4Iak75M5Og9QdNPQ+8r4JqTanj
	WfZ8RdZA2+G55O0/cWMi3TKet8TrNS5DZKvxmF+0Jdu2kMiwAFV6Gq1P46eh6IWD6HRO
	SU2g==
X-Gm-Message-State:	AD7BkJIcWo37xkR4X2PwoSFobag7gKdrx56t8EcW/seNwUVhpspCAIWqjBxS/0FWonmiQkgHM6lt0GRxeEARFw==
MIME-Version:	1.0
X-Received:	by 10.194.71.70 with SMTP id s6mr14582922wju.1.1459790446178; Mon,
	04 Apr 2016 10:20:46 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To:	<CACwWb3B2u9jt3t=ULNenxigjRDa7588UBfXiA0RV+BoN1L6qew@mail.gmail.com>
References:	<alpine DOT DEB DOT 2 DOT 00 DOT 1604040715260 DOT 7885 AT igor2priv>
	<CACwWb3B2u9jt3t=ULNenxigjRDa7588UBfXiA0RV+BoN1L6qew AT mail DOT gmail DOT com>
Date:	Mon, 4 Apr 2016 09:20:46 -0800
Message-ID:	<CAC4O8c8MZrxU3smt8_8fOPoHmZ7oLh+d3cmDRXO+UouvOmZTQQ@mail.gmail.com>
Subject:	Re: [geda-user] pcb: keyboard poll
From:	"Britton Kerin (britton DOT kerin AT gmail DOT com) [via geda-user AT delorie DOT com]" <geda-user AT delorie DOT com>
To:	geda-user AT delorie DOT com
Reply-To:	geda-user AT delorie DOT com
Errors-To:	nobody AT delorie DOT com
X-Mailing-List:	geda-user AT delorie DOT com
X-Unsubscribes-To:	listserv AT delorie DOT com

Hi Igor,

I didn't like any of the choices on a number of these questions so a
quick note instead, sorry.

I don't use lesstif.

I've never wanted to edit the menus.  I didn' t know until recently
that hot keys were controlled from there, and now I feel they keys are
mostly ok choices, I just don't like how a lot of the underlying
operations behave (but it's not easy to fix this by changing actions
alone).

Menus are for feature discovery and firing occasionally used features.
For the latter almost any arrangement is good enough.  For the former
pcb has problems because many menu items have undocumented context
requirements, appear to do nothing etc.  If you're doing anything with
menus I'd suggest focusing on discoverability of features.  I have a
half-finished branch that tries to do this for main line.

Britton

On Sun, Apr 3, 2016 at 11:21 PM, Levente (leventelist AT gmail DOT com) [via
geda-user AT delorie DOT com] <geda-user AT delorie DOT com> wrote:
> On Mon, Apr 4, 2016 at 7:45 AM,  <gedau AT igor2 DOT repo DOT hu> wrote:
>> Hi all,
>>
>> I'm in the middle of replacing menu.res with lihata in pcb-rnd. While at it,
>> I'm removing some code duplication between the gtk and lesstif hids and
>> moving some common input handling (mouse and keyboard binding lookup).
>>
>> I noticed the lesstif HID supports multi-key sequences (like gschem). I
>> guess I could easily end up having the same support for the gtk HID after
>> the above mentioned refactoring. However, I am not sure how PCB users use
>> their menu.res in practice and how much hassle changing the defaults would
>> be for an user.
>>
>> If you are using PCB, please answer each question (on the list or in
>> private) by marking your choices with a + before the letter of the choice.
>> You can also include comments, but please try to keep them short (or even
>> consider running a new thread for them).
>>
>> If you want to answer to others' comments, please change the topic of the
>> mail and separate that answer from filling in the poll.
>>
>>
>> 1. Do you use the lesstif HID? (select one)
>> a. yes, exclusively
>> b. yes, often
>> c. sometimes, rarely
>> d. never

d but it's a good example of how the hid abstraction works, sometimes
it's not totally clear from looking at just gtk


>> 2. If there were different menu resources files distributed with PCB, would
>> you try them? (select one)
>> a. yes, I'd give each variant a try before deciding which one to use
>> b. no, I'm fine with the default
>> c. I don't know what a menu resource file is

None of the above: I probably wouldn't get around to it but the
default is not fine

>> 3. Do you customize your menu resource file? (select one)
>> a. yes, always (e.g. I have an own variant I use with all installation of
>> PCB)
>> b. yes, sometimes, rarely (e.g. I once had to do something repeatedly and
>> added a key binding for that)
>> c. never, I know where I'd perform the changes if I ever needed them but
>> defalts are good enough for now
>> d. never, I don't know what a menu resource file is

c.  customizing hot keys can be worth it, menus no all they are for is
feature discovery and things done only occasionally

>> 4. If you do not costumize your menu resource file, it's because (select
>> zero or more):
>> a. I don't need to
>> b. the file is too long
>> c. too many keys are taken, it's hard to find a free one
>> d. I don't like the format of the file
>> e. I don't like the idea of editing text config files, I want a GUI for this
>> f. I don't want to diverge from the default settings (e.g. because of
>> potetial hassle at a later upgrade)
>
> f.
>
>> 5. Do you miss multi-key sequences from the GTK hid? (select one)
>> a. yes, I'd prefer to use them over modifiers (ctrl, alt, shift)
>> b. yes, I'd use them together with the modifiers
>> c. maybe I'd use some
>> d. no, I prefer modifiers
>> e. I hate the idea so much that I'd even disable it compile time if that was
>> possible
>> f. N/A, don't know
>
> a. It would be nice to have common format as gschem.
>
>> 6. If the GTK hid supported multi-key sequences, would that change any of
>> your previous answers? (fill in zero or more with a letter)
>> a. my new choice for 2. would be:
>> b. my new choice for 3. would be:
>
>
>
>
>> 7. slightly off-topic: vendor (drill) mapping also uses a resource file. Do
>> you use this feature? (select one)
>> a. yes, often, many of my boards rely on vendor mapping and I maintain my
>> own resource files per vendor
>> b. yes, sometimes, rarely (e.g. I needed it once...)
>> c. no, I know how to use it but never needed it
>> d. no, I know the feature exists and I know where to look it up but I don't
>> really know what exactly it can do or why I should bother
>> e. no, I never heard about this feature
>
> d.
>
>> TIA,
>>
>> Igor2

- Raw text -