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Mail Archives: djgpp-workers/1998/06/25/13:28:23

Message-Id: <m0ypFlu-000S3xC@inti.gov.ar>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <salvador AT natacha DOT inti DOT gov DOT ar>
From: "Salvador Eduardo Tropea (SET)" <salvador AT inti DOT gov DOT ar>
Organization: INTI
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz AT is DOT elta DOT co DOT il>, Nate Eldredge <nate AT cartsys DOT com>,
djgpp-workers AT delorie DOT com, DJ Delorie <dj AT delorie DOT com>
Date: Thu, 25 Jun 1998 14:31:05 +0000
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: Re: DJGPP v2.01 malloc wasting 4Kb
References: <m0yoout-000S3tC AT inti DOT gov DOT ar>
In-reply-to: <Pine.SUN.3.91.980624171810.24854A-100000@is>

Eli Zaretskii <eliz AT is DOT elta DOT co DOT il> wrote:

> On Wed, 24 Jun 1998, Salvador Eduardo Tropea (SET) wrote:
> 
> > Looks like:
> > 
> > 1) Nobody have enough time and motivations to put v2.02 in beta.
> 
> I think we all invest in v2.02 as much time and motivation as we possibly 
> can.  I know I do. 

But is not enough. I understand you and I know you do more than what I can ask 
from a person. But lamentably that's not enough. Don't get me wrong, I'm not 
telling: "Nobody invest time and nobody have motivations" I say: "not enough 
...".

>  If you can help make it happen faster, please do.  

Currently I don't have time for it, sorry.

> Accusing us in insufficient motivation is one thing that won't help.

That's why I'm asking to move the version number and let space for things that 
needs less effort.
 
> > 1) Change the version number of the alpha to v2.10 because:
> 
> Changing a version number doesn't change the contents.  It's just 
> semantics.

Yes I know, but suppose we call it in the reverse: djgpp v2.02 alpha and djgpp 
v2.10 beta .... that's a very confusing thing! or not? the next version with 
samller number?!
 
> > a) It adds new features and not only fixes bugs.
> 
> So did v2.01 after v2.0.

Isn't the point.
 
> > b) We need intermediate versions because we can't know when v2.10 will be
> > available.
> 
> DJ thinks intermediate versions make maintenance harder.  He is the 
> maintainer, so he gets to decide on that.  The patched libc was created to 
> fill the need in the meanwhile.

Exactly, I think you wrote it without reading the rest and after reding you 
left it. No?
 
> > c) We need a way to distinguish between v2.01 and the patched v2.01.
> 
> We already have that: the patched libc is available from a different 
> place, so there's no problem to distinguish between them.  It's not that 
> we need to make sure everybody uses exactly the same libc.  Most of those 
> who download the patched version know what they are doing, and the rest 
> uses the stock version.  I don't see where's the problem.

It generates problems put the patches in all the sources and ask the user to 
patch the libc is a very bad thing.
 
> > That's very important, specially if Eli is linking the binaries (and Eli
> > is the porter of most of v2gnu directory) with this library! The user must
> > know it! If the user doesn't know it and tries to recompile the gnu tool
> > from sources he will get a buggy release.
> 
> In those cases where patched functions are *required* to build the 
> binary, this is explained in the README.  In some extreme cases, I even 
> put the patched sources of library functions into the source 
> distribution, so people could patch their libraries before rebuilding.

Very annoying and time consuming! 
 
> I also don't think this is a big deal, since most of the people don't 
> rebuild from sources.  If they would, I'd rather stop distributing 
> binaries, as that's a lot of work.
> 
> > I think the patched library must be in the distribution because:
> > Suppose a magazine puts djgpp on CD and distributes it. Then suppose a user
> > buys the magazine and he don't have access to iNet. Then situation is very
> > bad: he have the sources of the tools but no way to creat a bug-free binary.
> 
> Nothing prevents that magazine from putting the patched libc on the CD.  
> That's what I did for the FSF CD-ROM that should be release RSN. 

I did it in my CD too, and so what? It doesn't help to make the things easier 
for people using other CDs or distributions.

>  For all 
> practical purposes, the patched libc *is* the intermediate version. 

For this reason I want it a little bit more clear and official.

>  If 
> the only problem is to make it available from SimTel, I don't have 
> anything against it.  DJ?

Yes, that's what I want. I simply want it to be:

1) More clear.
2) Easier for users.

and without charging it over DJ.
 
> Also, please note that some important patches in v2.02 are for the tools 
> (like djtar and redir).  I don't think these are less important than 
> libc.  Your suggestion ignores those bug-fixes.

Yes, that's why I think it must be v2.10 and be a whole distribution. And the 
patched just a v2.02 and only some binaries, libc.a for sure, perhaps another 
thing, not sure.
 
> > I know Eli can include the patches in the sources (are you doing it Eli?)
> > but I think that isn't the right way.
> 
> The only right way I know is to contribute to the effort of debugging and 
> putting v2.02 out the door as fast as we can.  This means taking part of 
> the job of improving the library upon yourself, if you feel that v2.02 is 
> moving too slowly.

But I'm not asking to rush v2.02! I just want to change the number and let 
space for an unofficial beta, but available from the main distribution.

You missunderstood my intention, I can't ask for a finished v2.02 because I'm 
not even working on it. I want something easier for the user. So if, for 
example, I distribute the sources of my editor I can simply say: "needed: libc 
v2.xx" and the user can get it from the main distribution. I think it isn't too 
much work.

SET
------------------------------------ 0 --------------------------------
Visit my home page: http://set-soft.home.ml.org/
or
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Vista/6552/
Salvador Eduardo Tropea (SET). (Electronics Engineer)
Alternative e-mail: set-soft AT usa DOT net set AT computer DOT org
ICQ: 2951574
Address: Curapaligue 2124, Caseros, 3 de Febrero
Buenos Aires, (1678), ARGENTINA
TE: +(541) 759 0013

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