X-Recipient:	archive-cygwin AT delorie DOT com
DomainKey-Signature:	a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=sourceware.org; h=list-id
	:list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-archive:list-post
	:list-help:sender:message-id:date:from:references:subject:to
	:content-type; q=dns; s=default; b=KVtsvpqixOP+baMaI2o4gr3XHYO8l
	KkksNnFfMODMiZD1iFUReazNGNgfulXnAEVC3mEMaXWSPRa4LTfHsfDty6mEch/+
	YuqUkq+UkP8M0cccqqK2u+a20R8KSgA9bDl96b2j9WpJT+rWa1ytvhyRsFDU2aaY
	52EZMw89xKw4NI=
DKIM-Signature:	v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed; d=sourceware.org; h=list-id
	:list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-archive:list-post
	:list-help:sender:message-id:date:from:references:subject:to
	:content-type; s=default; bh=bDdjcYeiHf/MHjF6WTd2U71DmxU=; b=yri
	VOtM6SUpdj0yuumB7htpXkqlKl9YlFrXqR7oeYEy+CiVmpkN9VBx2Yhd0G8lNAs1
	LT3PScf/dhqChYFcPG7hc/Dtetr7CXtioHoD1MQyiSfh8/0UkwC3CcVBlCc66ViR
	Ii7rV/xTUoq3xtfQxRpwPFPehlNJd4dOjj3GqPmg=
Mailing-List:	contact cygwin-help AT cygwin DOT com; run by ezmlm
List-Id:	<cygwin.cygwin.com>
List-Subscribe:	<mailto:cygwin-subscribe AT cygwin DOT com>
List-Archive:	<http://sourceware.org/ml/cygwin/>
List-Post:	<mailto:cygwin AT cygwin DOT com>
List-Help:	<mailto:cygwin-help AT cygwin DOT com>, <http://sourceware.org/ml/#faqs>
Sender:	cygwin-owner AT cygwin DOT com
Mail-Followup-To:	cygwin AT cygwin DOT com
Delivered-To:	mailing list cygwin AT cygwin DOT com
Authentication-Results:	sourceware.org; auth=none
X-Spam-SWARE-Status:	No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,FREEMAIL_FROM,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE,SPF_PASS autolearn=ham version=3.3.1 spammy=H*M:1c69fb81, somewhere, H*M:google, noticed
X-HELO:	mail-ot1-f50.google.com
DKIM-Signature:	v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=message-id:date:from:references:subject:to:user-agent; bh=XCNtiT6cA4aXeZMn2monTsXdF3a8hHwYJGz++XsXAiw=; b=n3aGlg0G8+RFrMr6u6Anm44SfdMVJQq7jh4xRx3VPch0ZUBCnSFLuQ4hV1vU2sgDMw j2mOl4RaQQuKAv51rOLS+2sfJ7FHDlmQwwnD2MsQ5gfJVdZqWVtEljGrncqkIg1a5I8y 82X13rMClsMUgE9uv2j2pqOr9uAg4BQtkkes+EfZEv6ZdzVlUiBXa+QDRkz1033onvu1 qERN7t3c5Zwqrsn4IKlPH4UdKWRIluqayPKitDPkUzMPgwExDOASgBB4rSqLBcin7Q7V 0P6Xm605mz7ytU1j+3OBpjFysJIyxY4B54FUZ24TaQB3JVR0EW84UVna4HqboeLZka4h iR0g==
Message-ID:	<5c9ab133.1c69fb81.d2609.60f1@mx.google.com>
Date:	Tue, 26 Mar 2019 16:09:39 -0700 (PDT)
From:	Steven Penny <svnpenn AT gmail DOT com>
References:	<1c57f64c080acc1bd5c2d2c0320e84d6baf217da DOT camel AT cygwin DOT com>
Subject:	Re: Python extraneous dependencies
To:	cygwin AT cygwin DOT com
User-Agent:	Tryst/2.8.0 (cup.github.io/suede/tryst)

On Tue, 26 Mar 2019 14:58:12, Yaakov Selkowitz wrote:
> Nak.  ctypes is part of the Python standard library and therefore the
> dependency needs to be on the main package(s).
> 
> BTW, binutils is usually included by default in all but the most
> minimal base installs, so I'm not quite sure why you object so much to
> this requirement.

Using Python 3.6 I noticed that a:

    print('hello world')

will actually work with only the Base packages and the "python36" package, and
none of the current "python36" dependencies installed. Obviously this comes with
some caveats as you have pointed out. But my counter is this:

- Current "python36" package is 5,746,648 bytes
- "binutils" 2.29 package is 5,863,216 bytes

So by choosing to have "binutils" as a dependency we are literally doubling the
size of Cygwin Python install. To me this is not trivial. I know with Git it
used to "require" Python but not really - it was only some ancillary scripts
that were eventually broken out into their own package so that the Python
requirement could be removed from Cygwin Git.

To contrast however the Perl dependency remained with Cygwin Git as currently
its too ingrained to be removed. What Im saying is that while you are
technically correct that "binutils" is a requirement for current Cygwin Python,
it doesnt have to be that way. We could move the Python elements that require
binutils into their own package, or we could create a "python_base" similar to
"perl_base".

I think if we just say "something somewhere in the bowels of Python needs it, so
it must be a hard dependency", even if that thing is rarely used by anyone, we
are doing a disservice to the Cygwin community. However that may not be the case
and perhaps "ctypes" is used much more than I am aware of.

Thanks


--
Problem reports:       http://cygwin.com/problems.html
FAQ:                   http://cygwin.com/faq/
Documentation:         http://cygwin.com/docs.html
Unsubscribe info:      http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple

- Raw text -