Mail Archives: geda-user/2017/07/08/20:19:07
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On Jul 8, 2017, at 4:04 PM, Peter Stuge (peter AT stuge DOT se) [via =
geda-user AT delorie DOT com] <geda-user AT delorie DOT com> wrote:
> Hi John,
>=20
> what you did in this thread is absolutely unacceptable, and you
> need to watch yourself so that you never do it again in this
> community, or in any other. I will try to point it out clearly:
My comments were in response to Roland=92s:
> I'm still not sure why you are trying to re-create the efforts I have =
already made refactoring gnetlist.
I was explaining why I think Vladimir=92s efforts are productive. I =
don=92t understand why you don=92t like what I=92m saying to Roland, =
which is basically =93I think what you=92re doing is good, but I=92m not =
climbing on board because I see some problems relative to Vladimir=92s =
approach=94, while at the same time you don=92t criticize Roland for his =
completely negative attitude about lepton.
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> John Doty wrote:
>> using our traditional foundation, Scheme
> ..
>> We=92ve been well served by Scheme in the past.
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> You say that you do not want to change, away from Scheme.
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> John Doty wrote:
>>> By now, the refactored code is 100% compatible with existing Scheme =
code.
>>=20
>> But that=92s no advance.
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> Then you criticize that the refactored code is backwards compatible,
> made so such that you (and others) don't *need* to change, away from =
Scheme.
Except that what Vladimir is doing *is* an advance, *both* backward =
compatible and more extensible in Scheme.
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> This is as clear a case of trolling as there ever will be, which is
> completely unacceptable, and you need to stop it or GTFO - =
immediately!
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>> A valid criticism, but Vladimir is moving the boundary so that more
>> functionality is implemented in Scheme. That=92s especially helpful
>> to me because more is therefore exposed to customization.
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> I know that there are people who are excited about the intersection
> of Scheme and gEDA, which is cool, but I support Roland's approach
> and effort to move away from Scheme, simply because it is more
> sustainable.
And I have supported it, if you=92ve followed all my comments over =
recent years. But I see some problems:
1. I agree that those who find Scheme difficult should have an =
alternative. However, some of us find Scheme a good tool. We shouldn=92t =
be stuck with mere backward compatibility.
2. Those who claim to want an alternative have not, so far as I know, =
come forward to embrace Roland=92s approach as a foundation for their =
own customizations. I=92ve looked at it and found it difficult to =
comprehend. Sometimes it seems that Roland thinks *I* should be his test =
case, but I=92m more fluent with Scheme than Python, xorn seems =
confusing and unnecessary to me, and I find my thinking more in sync =
with Vladimir=92s.
> The Scheme cost/benefit ratio is far too high.
Who=92s being disparaging now?
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> This being free software you have the freedom (and responsibility!)
> to maintain your own project when you disagree with other projects.
And that=92s why I=92m working with Vladimir on lepton now. Roland =
objects. By your own logic he shouldn=92t.
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> What you don't have if you disagree, is a right to occupy other
> peoples' time.
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>> It was not easier for *me* to understand (obviously it is for you).
> ..
>> To a Schemer, Vladimir=92s approach is more transparent.
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> Great! Work with that project, and stay silent about others.
Tell that to Roland, then.
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>> But the real question is whether either approach will attract
>> add-on authors the way Ales=92s Scheme API did.
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> I think Roland's effort has created more potential for it.
And if it happens, I=92ll cheer. I am not opposed to Roland=92s effort. =
It is Roland who opposes lepton.
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> //Peter
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I find your unbalanced emotional interference in technical discussion =
unacceptable. Please don=92t do this again.
John Doty Noqsi Aerospace, Ltd.
http://www.noqsi.com/
jpd AT noqsi DOT com
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